Date: Mon, 20 Jun 2005 21:59:31 -0400
To: deleuze-guattari-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Subject: Re: [D-G] the "virtual"


Doesn't virtual just mean unformed effect?


On 6/20/05, hwenk <hwenk-AT-web.de> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> unfortunately I think in respect the virtual and creatipon, that the virtual
> is a variant of the potential,
> from the potential - act theory by Aristotle taken up by the scholatics.
> As you know, by Parmenides a ceation ex nihilo was foreign to ancient greek
> thinking,
> including Plato, Aristotle the Stoa etc.
> There has bee a lot of struggle from the early christians to
> overcome this doctrin and in spite of that to integrate Plato and Aristotle
> as prominent and
> authorative (which meant a lot in the medieval times).
> So, in my eyes, the virtual of Deleuze is not so much preformed as the
> potential (including the final cause or teleos), nowadays broken down to the
> possible (worlds) - as already expressed in the last email.
>
> greetings Harald
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: deleuze-guattari-driftline.org-bounces-AT-lists.driftline.org
> [mailto:deleuze-guattari-driftline.org-bounces-AT-lists.driftline.org]On
> Behalf Of sid littlefield
> Sent: Donnerstag, 9. Juni 2005 16:52
> To: deleuze-guattari-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
> Subject: RE: [D-G] the "virtual"
>
>
> yes it seems that the virtual is a force/power, as its etymology attests to,
> but it  also important to remember that although Deleuze affirms its reality
> (against Kant/Aristotle, the tradition) he also returns to the fact that the
> virtual is not, does not, resemble the actual. And so a gulf remands, but it
> is this gulf that allows Deleuze to posit a theory of the new without making
> the two mistakes of philosophy, namely that the new is creation ex nihilio
> (theological) or the combination of the parts of history. A novel theory
> about novelty. It is Deleuze that says that every work of art has something
> ahistorical about it.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: hwenk <hwenk-AT-web.de>
> To: deleuze-guattari-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
> Subject: RE: [D-G] the "virtual"
> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 12:44:39 +0200
>
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > I think you are right, the virtual is some kind of power or force.
> > I think Deleuze struggles (in Difference et repetition) with this concept
> > against the possibilty,
> > which, according to Kant, is the thing only lacking existence.
> > This is also not true in my eyes. but the possible is much more preformed
> > than the virtual.
> >
> >
> > greetings Harald
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: deleuze-guattari-driftline.org-bounces-AT-lists.driftline.org
> > [mailto:deleuze-guattari-driftline.org-bounces-AT-lists.driftline.org]On
> > Behalf Of Jeremy Livingston
> > Sent: Montag, 24. Januar 2005 18:21
> > To: deleuze-guattari-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
> > Subject: [D-G] the "virtual"
> >
> >
> > I think "virtual" is meant to be a concept of (dare I say it)
> > ontology; I think it's meant to be a contribution toward getting a
> > vocabulary in which we can talk about the world without resorting to
> > objectivistic or transcendental realism. "Virtual" is a concept of
> > immanence and dynamism: the "virtual" is that (or "virtuals" are
> > those) by virtue of which an event unfolds in just the way it does;
> > the virtual factor is an analytic element of "A LIFE" (where
> > life-events are immanent to consciousness). The virtual is the power
> > of the world. Like a less metaphoricalized or anthropomorphized
> > version of Nietzsche's locus of "will to power", if you like -- and I
> > think this is important, that "virtual" is meant to mean "pertaining
> > to power", virtus, not "pertaining to the unreal or illusory".
> >
> > Or maybe I'm just mixed up.
> > Jeremy
> >
> > > Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2005 19:21:45 -0800
> > > From: "sid littlefield" <falsedeity-AT-lycos.com>
> > > Subject: RE: [D-G] Deleuze and the symbolic
> > > To: deleuze-guattari-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
> > > Message-ID: <20050122032145.0161C86B0D-AT-ws7-1.us4.outblaze.com>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> > >
> > > I don't think the virtual can be reduced to "interpretation mediated by
> > reality". It seems to reside in Deleuze's metaphysics. I will speak more
> to
> > this later.
> > >
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