From: "Alan Cook" <alangregorycook-AT-msn.com>
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 15:25:26 GMT
Cc:
Subject: [Puptcrit] Carl Harms' passing
Carl Harms loved good puppet theatre. After a recent (post-fest) visit to the MacNider Art Museum to see the Bil Baird exhibit I found myself thinking a lot about Carl too since he directed the wonderful revival of PINOCCHIO at the MIT National Puppetry Festival by the Baird Marionettes.
He was so excited about that production. For one thing, Peter Baird provided the voice and singing for Pinocchio in this version. He loved that ---"it is sooo musical" he said.
Carl was a great help to me in 1980 at the PofA World Festival in Washington, DC, working on the puppet exhibit in that barn of a gymnasium in Georgetown. He'd wanted to do an exhibit of puppets used for Shakespeare plays at the Folger Library, but the Library was under renovation, so he asked for a space in the gym, which added so much to the exhibit.
He was an ideal room mate, willing to put up with stacks of boxes destined for the Fest exhibit which temporarily had to be stored in our room.
He had lots of puppet history stored in his head, and I'm grateful that Bob Nathanson & Elise Handelman got an interview with Carl. In earlier days many people in theatre were class acts and felt an obligation to be good examples of humanity---after all, theatre was ABOUT humanity, and there was a religious aspect to theatre, and onstage things should be worthy of doing. Carl was such a person. Edward "Ted" Mabley (half of Tatterman Marionettes) and Ellen van Volkenburg (Chicago Little Theatre and later Cornish School in Seattle) all expressed deep respect for the arts of puppetry. Obviously it is not possible for younger puppeteers to know Carl at this late date, but it IS possible to know about him.
I was not just saddened by news of Carl's death. I felt a shock, and it will take time getting used to the news. I hope the interview will soon be available in completed form.
The future needs its past.----ALAN COOK
-----Original Message-----
From: puptcrit-driftline.org-request-AT-lists.driftline.org
Sent: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 03:59:06 -0700
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Subject: Puptcrit-driftline.org Digest, Vol 10, Issue 28
Send Puptcrit-driftline.org mailing list submissions to
=09puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
=09http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
=09puptcrit-driftline.org-request-AT-lists.driftline.org
You can reach the person managing the list at
=09puptcrit-driftline.org-owner-AT-lists.driftline.org
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Puptcrit-driftline.org digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. set digest plain (Dave Homsher)
2. Re: Muppet Auditions??? (Andrew)
3. Re: Muppet Auditions??? (Brett Roberts)
4. Re: Carl Harms' passing (Mary Robinette Kowal)
5. Re: Carl Harms' passing (lindsey briggs)
6. Re: Muppet Auditions??? (Tara Conlon)
7. New puppets to show (Mathieu Ren?)
8. Re: Carl Harms' passing (Widerman-AT-aol.com)
9. Re: Muppet Auditions??? (Andrew)
10. Re: New puppets to show (Andrew)
11. Re: New puppets to show (Mathieu Ren?)
12. Re: Carl Harms' passing (BNathanson-AT-aol.com)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 20:54:49 -0400
From: Dave Homsher <dave-AT-homsher.com>
Subject: [Puptcrit] set digest plain
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <42FD44D9.7060201-AT-homsher.com>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 21:34:30 -0400
From: Andrew <beartown-AT-bear-town.com>
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Muppet Auditions???
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <42FD4E26.6080706-AT-bear-town.com>
I hate to ruin the illusion for anyone who doesn't know, but this has=20
been going on for years and years, especially with Frank Oz's
characters. Until a few years ago what would typically happen when one=20
puppeteer wasn't available apparently another would sub in and voice
would be dubbed afterwards. The last year or two they appear to not
bother dubbing over as much and are just letting different puppeteers do=20
different characters.
- Andrew
Brett Roberts wrote:
> I just hate the idea that the individual Muppets might have several=20
> people performing them. Lip synching I'm okay with, but when several=20
> people do the voices, I think they've sunk to the level of Barney.
>
> Brett
>
> Brett Roberts Productions
> http://DFWentertainer.com
> For promotional pictures please go to
> http://brettrobertsproductions.itgo.com
>
>
>
>
>> From: Andrew <beartown-AT-bear-town.com>
>> Reply-To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
>> To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
>> Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Muppet Auditions???
>> Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:41:29 -0400
>>
>> Yes, that's right. As I understand they are specifically looking for=20
>> puppeteers who can manipulate, sing and imitate the classic Muppet=20
>> characters.
>>
>> - Andrew
>>
>> Michael wrote:
>>
>>> Its not just for a touring show such as the ones VEE produce, or
>>> ones that
>>> Disney do, if that were the case they would just pre-record the
>>> voices and
>>> have puppeteers lip synch.
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Mathieu Ren" <creaturiste-AT-magma.ca>
>>> To: <puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org>
>>> Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 10:05 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Muppet Auditions???
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> How can they replace Kermit?
>>>> Steve Withmire does a great job already!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mathieu Ren Craturiste
>>>> Marionnettes, Masques, Etcetera...
>>>> Puppets, Masks, Etcetera...
>>>> creaturiste-AT-magma.ca
>>>> www.creaturiste.com
>>>> (514) 274-8027
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>>>> Admin interface:
>>>>
>>>>
>>> http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>>>
>>>
>>>> Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>>> Admin interface:
>>> http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>>> Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Andrew
>>
>> The PuppetVision Blog
>> "The web's best source for puppet film and video goodness, delivered=20
>> fresh to your computer each day."
>> http://puppetvision.blogspot.com
>>
>> RSS Feed - http://feeds.feedburner.com/blogspot/XVGw
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>> Admin interface:
>> http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>> Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
> Admin interface:
> http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
> Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>
>
>
Andrew
The PuppetVision Blog
"The web's best source for puppet film and video goodness, delivered fresh to your computer each day."
http://puppetvision.blogspot.com
RSS Feed - http://feeds.feedburner.com/blogspot/XVGw
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 21:05:20 -0500
From: "Brett Roberts" <bdr1020-AT-hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Muppet Auditions???
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <BAY102-F26304E882D173884EDB880B8BF0-AT-phx.gbl>
This is very true... but, it's still a shame.
And, I don't want to sound like I'm contradicting myself but, I do happen to
think Eric is doing a wonderful job with Frank's characters.
Brett
Brett Roberts Productions
http://DFWentertainer.com
For promotional pictures please go to
http://brettrobertsproductions.itgo.com
>From: Andrew <beartown-AT-bear-town.com>
>Reply-To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
>To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
>Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Muppet Auditions???
>Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 21:34:30 -0400
>
>I hate to ruin the illusion for anyone who doesn't know, but this has been
>going on for years and years, especially with Frank Oz's characters. Until
>a few years ago what would typically happen when one puppeteer wasn't=20
>available apparently another would sub in and voice would be dubbed
>afterwards. The last year or two they appear to not bother dubbing over as
>much and are just letting different puppeteers do different characters.
>
>- Andrew
>
>Brett Roberts wrote:
>
>>I just hate the idea that the individual Muppets might have several people
>>performing them. Lip synching I'm okay with, but when several people do
>>the voices, I think they've sunk to the level of Barney.
>>
>>Brett
>>
>>Brett Roberts Productions
>>http://DFWentertainer.com
>>For promotional pictures please go to
>>http://brettrobertsproductions.itgo.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>From: Andrew <beartown-AT-bear-town.com>
>>>Reply-To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
>>>To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
>>>Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Muppet Auditions???
>>>Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:41:29 -0400
>>>
>>>Yes, that's right. As I understand they are specifically looking for=20
>>>puppeteers who can manipulate, sing and imitate the classic Muppet=20
>>>characters.
>>>
>>>- Andrew
>>>
>>>Michael wrote:
>>>
>>>>Its not just for a touring show such as the ones VEE produce, or ones
>>>>that
>>>>Disney do, if that were the case they would just pre-record the voices
>>>>and
>>>>have puppeteers lip synch.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>From: "Mathieu Ren" <creaturiste-AT-magma.ca>
>>>>To: <puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org>
>>>>Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 10:05 PM
>>>>Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Muppet Auditions???
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>How can they replace Kermit?
>>>>>Steve Withmire does a great job already!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Mathieu Ren Craturiste
>>>>>Marionnettes, Masques, Etcetera...
>>>>>Puppets, Masks, Etcetera...
>>>>>creaturiste-AT-magma.ca
>>>>>www.creaturiste.com
>>>>>(514) 274-8027
>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>>>>>Admin interface:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>>>>Admin interface:
>>>>http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>>>>Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>--
>>>Andrew
>>>
>>>The PuppetVision Blog
>>>"The web's best source for puppet film and video goodness, delivered=20
>>>fresh to your computer each day."
>>>http://puppetvision.blogspot.com
>>>
>>>RSS Feed - http://feeds.feedburner.com/blogspot/XVGw
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>>>Admin interface:
>>>http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>>>Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>>Admin interface:
>>http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>>Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>>
>>
>>
>
>--
>Andrew
>
>The PuppetVision Blog
>"The web's best source for puppet film and video goodness, delivered fresh
>to your computer each day."
>http://puppetvision.blogspot.com
>
>RSS Feed - http://feeds.feedburner.com/blogspot/XVGw
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>Admin interface:
>http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>Archives: http://www.driftline.org
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 19:06:30 -0700
From: Mary Robinette Kowal <mary-AT-otherhandproductions.com>
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Carl Harms' passing
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <42FD55A6.1070109-AT-otherhandproductions.com>
Oh no.
Mary Robinette Kowal
Other Hand Productions
http://www.otherhandproductions.com
Vincent Anthony wrote:
>Yes, this is very sad news.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: puptcrit-driftline.org-bounces-AT-lists.driftline.org
>[mailto:puptcrit-driftline.org-bounces-AT-lists.driftline.org] On Behalf Of
>Karen Larsen
>Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 4:27 PM
>To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
>Subject: [Puptcrit] Carl Harms' passing
>
>We've lost one of the most elegant elder statesmen puppetry ever had.
>
>_______________________________________________
>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>Admin interface:
>http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>
>_______________________________________________
>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>Admin interface: http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 23:40:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: "lindsey briggs" <lindsey-briggs-AT-excite.com>
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Carl Harms' passing
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <20050813034009.7D8918AEBB-AT-xprdmailfe2.nwk.excite.com>
I feel so very fortunate to have met him.
-z.
--- On Fri 08/12, Mary Robinette Kowal < mary-AT-otherhandproductions.com > wrote:
From: Mary Robinette Kowal [mailto: mary-AT-otherhandproductions.com]
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 19:06:30 -0700
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Carl Harms' passing
Oh no.<br><br>Mary Robinette Kowal<br>Other Hand Productions<br>http://www.otherhandproductions.com<br><br><br><br>Vincent Anthony wrote:<br><br>>Yes, this is very sad news.<br>><br>>-----Original Message-----<br>>From: puptcrit-driftline.org-bounces-AT-lists.driftline.org<br>>[mailto:puptcrit-driftline.org-bounces-AT-lists.driftline.org] On Behalf Of<br>>Karen Larsen<br>>Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 4:27 PM<br>>To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org<br>>Subject: [Puptcrit] Carl Harms' passing<br>><br>>We've lost one of the most elegant elder statesmen puppetry ever had.<br>><br>>_______________________________________________<br>>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org<br>>Admin interface:<br>>http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org<br>>Archives: http://www.driftline.org<br>><br>>_______________________________________________<br>>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org<br>>Admin interface:
http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org<br>>Archives: http://www.driftline.org<br>><br>> <br>><br>_______________________________________________<br>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org<br>Admin interface: http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org<br>Archives: http://www.driftline.org<br>
_______________________________________________
Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 21:02:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tara Conlon <putmyhandinsidethepuppethead-AT-yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Muppet Auditions???
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <20050813040250.28434.qmail-AT-web30909.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
my guess would be that since a sequel to dark crystal is in the works, that could potentially conflict with what's going on with the muppets (since dark crystal is still being done by henson, i believe, but the classic muppets are now with disney). the 'understudies' are probably being hired and trained in the event that the current muppeteers abdicate in favor of the movie.
-tara
=09=09
---------------------------------
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 02:49:45 -0400
From: Mathieu Ren? <creaturiste-AT-magma.ca>
Subject: [Puptcrit] New puppets to show
To: <puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org>,
=09<PuppetCafe-AT-yahoogroups.com>, <PaperMacheArt-AT-yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <000601c59fd3$325e16b0$1f34f3c7-AT-critter1>
Hi all.
I have finished some walker puppets I will sell today at a puppet event.
I also have some pics of some works in progress (Kimi, Colonel, Orc). These are following my recent post about works in progress.
Kimi is made with three kinds of fake fur. The body is made from a sleeve from my mother's old fake fursuit. It is installed so that the hair do not run in their natural direction, meaning she always looks like her hair is up.
The eyes are re-enforced ping pong balls, painted in acrylics, and coated with counter-top resin (one coat =55 coats, etc...)
All can be seen here:
www.magma.ca/~uubald/kimi/
Feedback welcome.
Mathieu Ren Craturiste
Marionnettes, Masques, Etcetera...
Puppets, Masks, Etcetera...
creaturiste-AT-magma.ca
www.creaturiste.com
(514) 274-8027
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 02:53:34 EDT
From: Widerman-AT-aol.com
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Carl Harms' passing
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <198.44dbd20f.302ef2ee-AT-aol.com>
I am greatly saddened to hear of Carl's passing. I am honored to have worked
with and learned from him.
-Steven->
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 03:10:20 -0400
From: Andrew <beartown-AT-bear-town.com>
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Muppet Auditions???
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <42FD9CDC.30904-AT-bear-town.com>
There has been a lot of speculation like that in the Muppet fan
community since word of these auditions got out, but I have it on very=20
good authority that they are not auditioning understudies or people to=20
work on film/TV projects. This is strictly for things like theme park=20
work, live shows, limited low-level PR and that kind of thing.
That being said, it still sounds like a great gig, especially for
someone who wants to break in to the biz. The auditions are being held=20
in Toronto, LA and New York for anyone interested and the details are=20
posted on the PofA's bulletin board I believe.
- Andrew
Tara Conlon wrote:
>my guess would be that since a sequel to dark crystal is in the works, that could potentially conflict with what's going on with the muppets (since dark crystal is still being done by henson, i believe, but the classic muppets are now with disney). the 'understudies' are probably being hired and trained in the event that the current muppeteers abdicate in favor of the movie.
>-tara
>
>=09=09
>---------------------------------
> Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
>_______________________________________________
>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>Admin interface: http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>
>
>
>
>
Andrew
The PuppetVision Blog
"The web's best source for puppet film and video goodness, delivered fresh to your computer each day."
http://puppetvision.blogspot.com
RSS Feed - http://feeds.feedburner.com/blogspot/XVGw
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 03:20:38 -0400
From: Andrew <beartown-AT-bear-town.com>
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] New puppets to show
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <42FD9F46.8070109-AT-bear-town.com>
Those are so cute Mathieu! I did some slightly similar ones with a
school group awhile back using those foam water noodles.
Out of curiosity, how much does something like that sell for?
- Andrew
Mathieu Ren wrote:
>Hi all.
>
>I have finished some walker puppets I will sell today at a puppet event.
>I also have some pics of some works in progress (Kimi, Colonel, Orc). These are following my recent post about works in progress.
>
>Kimi is made with three kinds of fake fur. The body is made from a sleeve from my mother's old fake fursuit. It is installed so that the hair do not run in their natural direction, meaning she always looks like her hair is up.
>
>The eyes are re-enforced ping pong balls, painted in acrylics, and coated with counter-top resin (one coat =55 coats, etc...)
>
>
>All can be seen here:
>www.magma.ca/~uubald/kimi/
>
>
>Feedback welcome.
>
>
>Mathieu Ren Craturiste
>Marionnettes, Masques, Etcetera...
>Puppets, Masks, Etcetera...
>creaturiste-AT-magma.ca
>www.creaturiste.com
>(514) 274-8027
>_______________________________________________
>List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
>Admin interface: http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
>Archives: http://www.driftline.org
>
>
>
>
>
Andrew
The PuppetVision Blog
"The web's best source for puppet film and video goodness, delivered fresh to your computer each day."
http://puppetvision.blogspot.com
RSS Feed - http://feeds.feedburner.com/blogspot/XVGw
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 06:20:32 -0400
From: Mathieu Ren? <creaturiste-AT-magma.ca>
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] New puppets to show
To: <puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org>
Message-ID: <000301c59ff0$a457ebc0$1f34f3c7-AT-critter1>
=09reply-type=response
Hi Andrew.
These walkers have not sold yet. today is test day.
I was thinking about selling at $15 CAD each.
If the price scares most people, an hour later I'll go as low as 10$.
They take me 15 minutes max each to make, unless I have fun and try
different features.
Basically, I'll be satisfied if I sell at least enough to pay my whole day
of working there.
LoL. I take it as a market study event.
Of course, if I sell them all, I'll be so thrilled!
Mathieu Ren Craturiste
Marionnettes, Masques, Etcetera...
Puppets, Masks, Etcetera...
creaturiste-AT-magma.ca
www.creaturiste.com
(514) 274-8027
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 06:58:49 EDT
From: BNathanson-AT-aol.com
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Carl Harms' passing
To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
Message-ID: <65.4b4f65a6.302f2c69-AT-aol.com>
In 1993, my wife, Elise Handelman and myself spent an afternoon with Carl at
his apartment and did a video history of his magnificent career. That video
is presently with the Puppeteers of America archives. I don't believe it has
ever been edited down to a finished product, but at least we were able tp
preserve Carl's thoughts, desires and rememberances for posterity. He was truly an
amazing man. Bob Nathanson
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
Admin interface: http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
Archives: http://www.driftline.org
End of Puptcrit-driftline.org Digest, Vol 10, Issue 28
******************************************************
_______________________________________________
List address: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
Admin interface: http://lists.driftline.org/listinfo.cgi/puptcrit-driftline.org
Archives: http://www.driftline.org
Display software: ArchTracker © Malgosia Askanas, 2000-2005