Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:39:24 -0500 (EST)
From: danceswithcarp <dcombs-AT-bloomington.in.us>
Subject: Re: Anarchy Magazine and Violence




On Thu, 29 Apr 1999, ben blumson wrote:

> And if I want to listen to mild putdowns i can go to;
> http://pharmdec.wustl.edu/cgi-bin/jardin_scripts/SCG

Don;t let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

 
> > Not really.  If you/we had any "power" over events there the ethnic
> > cleansing would stop.  You and I both know that your statement 
> > should
> > read: "We +may+ have a little power as far as living in liberal
> > democracies goes, towards affecting the policies of the liberal
> > democracies.  We have ZERO power to influence the fascist war 
> > criminals
> > who have now displaced 1.2 million Albanian ethnics.  Therefore, 
> > being
> > powerless to confront the true fascists, well, let's simply do 
> > something
> > like attack the liberal democracies."
> > 
> > This argument is really a pathetic attempt to come up with an 
> > acceptable
> > "leftist" position. 
> 
> so if it was the former soviet union intervening violently (or at all)
> in kosovo it would be wrong but if its a liberal democracy its
> alright. 

No, it would be perfectly all right with me as ;long as itwasn't a war of 
conquest or imperial design. 

You are the one who said that silly stuff about having "power to
"influence" events.  I merely had the bad taste to show you how weak that
position is.
 
> I don't really give a damn what kind of government is doing
> what, if it was anarchists bombing serbia i would opose it as much as
> if it were fascists. Milosivichs regime is commiting atrocities NATO's
> actions are far from innocent, they've caused a new wave of killing in
> kosovo in retaliation as well as killing lots of others by bombs. I
> think human life is more important than 'liberal democracies'. 

Look, sport, you made a very ridiculous statement that we had some "power"
to influence events.   I did not endorse the liberal democracies, you did
by inferring  they would let you play.   Or were you inferring that you
had some wire up Milosevic's ass and could make him jump?   Tell me, bean,
exactly +what+ "power" to influence events were you referring to.

>  Aswell
> as this NATO itself is a 'defensive' aliance which goes to show that
> what a thing is called has little to do with what it does. Id be
> deeply ingratiated though if someone could tell me how nato is meant
> to work. ive learnt a lot about the un but nothing on NATO.
 
NATO was originally designed to do two things, confront the perception
that the U$$R was expansionist, and standardize the measurements and
logistics of the western arms industry.  When issue number one disappeared
they changed to another issue.   It was in all of the papers.

>  
> > And for what it's wirth, I'm willing to sacrifice every pacifist 
> > in europe
> > just to see me proved worng.
> 
> What ever action you've suggested its nearly always involved killing
> people 

Don't lie. I just said I didn't care if it was armed intervention or not.   
Then I came up with the wonderful idea to let the peaceniks make a grand
march and sit-in in Kosovo to see if that would wirk (WIRK?).   Why is it
no Ghandi-types are marching there?


> and i think inaction is
> preferable to that 

Why? Because it isn't you being robbed of your home and life's toils?  We
oppose capitalism for the same reason, but yet you quake in the face of
armed robbers.   I don't care if the robber has a gun or a timeclock, it's
the same principle in action.

> though you seem to
> care little so long as their not American.

You don't care because it's not you.   If you were robbed of your home and
labor at gunpoint would you turn down assistance?    My guess is you'd cry
for it. But that's just a guess.  What would you do, turn assistance down
or simply give up your family's labors?




carp