File spoon-archives/anarchy-list.archive/anarchy-list_2001/anarchy-list.0104, message 229


From: "res02iqa-AT-gte.net" <res02iqa-AT-gte.net>
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 09:38:15 -0700
Subject: Re: Protest Groups Breach Security at Quebec Summit


On 25 Apr 01, at 17:07, roger wrote:

> res02iga-AT-gte.net said:
> >
> > I think it's a good sign. Rioting for the hell of it, voter apathy,
> all
> > good signs.
> >
> > When people start to feel alienated, they react by either getting
> > apathetic about voting ( "it does no good"....heh ), or they get
> > destructive.
> >
> > Voter apathy and nihilism is the first step on the road to
> revolution.
> >
> 
> interesting theory but i disagree for two reasons (don't get me wrong,
> i love nihilism as much as the next guy).  first, the theory that
> alienation leads to destructive action which translates into progress
> is suspect in the extreme.  the KKK were just a bunch of pissed-off
> white guys but they were hardly progressive, much less
> anti-authoritarian.  alienated, rampaging homophobic skinhead fascists
> do not constitute an improved state of affairs.  i refer you to
> Kristalnacht (or however the hell you spell it) in 1930's gerrrmany as
> a great example of what i mean.
> 

Happy and content people have no interest in rocking any boats. Period.

People need to get more than a bit unhappy with the status quo to 
do *anything*. It's our job to convince them that fascists do not 
have good answers to their problems.

> second, the underlying concept that increasing the suffering of the
> opprssed will lead to revolution is pernicious and evil.  more crap
> has been done by 'revolutionairies' in the service of this myth than
> can be believed.  we should strive to alieveate suffering and

Yes, we need to make things better. This does not mean we 
should simply ignore the State's errors when they make folks 
angry. The reason fascists ( who pose as revolutionaries ) have 
conned these folks into putting them in power is because they have 
recognized that people need to be unhappy with the status quo 
before they start to demand change.

> alienation, not increase it, or worse yet attempt to opportunistically
> use it and 'latch on' to any and every transient political cause.  we

Happy people are not interested in change.

As for increasing alienation, I cannot do that. Only the State has 
the power to do that. And the statists are doing it, and digging their 
own graves without realizing it. Heh.

> should  model non-coersive, free practices and procedures, not
> aimlessly strike out with pointless violence.  we can defend

Please point out where I advocated pointless violence.

> ourselves, sure.  and when the crunch comes, violence is almost always
> the final arbiter.  but fight battles to win, not to lose gloriously.

Where did I advocate losing graciously? Some else's words, not 
mine. I fight to win. And I cheat when I fight, as well. :)

> 
> and i do not think that the brutal, personal, lethal violence that was
> unleashed in pioneer sqare here in seattle on mardi gras has any damn
> thing to do with any thing i want to be a part of.

Correct. This anger is there for good reason, but is misdirected. 
We need to try to make it clear to these folks that there are good 
choices other than fascism or self-destruction.

I still think that apathy and nihilism are good signs. A whole 
generation is starting to realize that they are being oppressed. We 
need to get better ideas to these people. If you think that mindless 
violence is bad ( as do I ), then you need to show these folks that 
other alternatives exist.


Regards,

Kristopher K. Barrett

   

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