From: "Harald Beyer-Arnesen" <haraldba-AT-online.no>
Subject: AUT: Re: Re: Re: Algeria
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 04:03:33 +0200



-----Original Message-----
From: cwright <cwright-AT-21stcentury.net>
To: aut-op-sy-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu
<aut-op-sy-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu>
Date: 24. oktober 2001 9:06
Subject: AUT: Re: Re: Algeria



Chris, thanks for your reply,

I have to clarify what I have been trying to say.
You read _a lot_ of things into what I have written that never was there.
And you read me moralistically, I think.

Here is a list:

"Also, it strikes me that your position already fails to ever raise French
violence against Algerians: police and military violence, expropriation of
land, denial of culture, torture, etc.  Instead, you start with and end with
the violence of the Algerian nationalists, who are to blame for the
increased nationalism of the French.  Really, isn't this too much?  What
next?  The Black Panther Party in the US was responsible for the KKK?
Indeed, the struggle against oppression always engenders a backlash, but
that backlash is not the fault of the oppressed, and your refusal to
concretely recognize that France oppressed Algerians as Algerians is
stunning to me."

"All of this is an apology for French nationalism, Harald.  I am surprised
that you cannot see that you have made the Algerians the villains and
allowed France off the hook."

"But that might assume that France bears some responsibility in this,
not just Algerian nationalism."

"Can you think of a situation where you would defend French colonialism?
If you can asnwer yes to the second question, then you are concretely
opposed to their RIGHT to break with France and you are defending
French national chauvinism because you defend France's right to tell
the people of Algeria what to do."

"Refusing to oppose French colonialism and recognize it as the main enemy of
both the colonized subject and the French worker is support for French
colonialism"

"Rather, I only think that defence of that right is a premise to fighting
French national chauvinism and to displaying real unity with the Algerians,
who you blame for French racism."

"It was not up to France to decide, but France made a democratic
decision in Algeria, even along bourgeois democratic lines, impossible.
Where is your critique of French refusal to allow this?"

"As I said, blame the Algerians.  Not France.  Harald, this is great-power
chauvinism of the worst sort. ... I prefer Algeria because it shows that in
every case you have blamed the Algerians and the 'little nationalists' for
every evil, every chauvinism, every increase in chauvinism, etc while you
have mentioned French expropriations, land-grabbing, enclosures,
torture, police and military abuses, etc, NOT ONCE.  As I said, the
nationalism at hand is not the NLF but imperial chauvinism."


Hope I have not forgotten anything.


I have read Fanon, though it is a very long time ago, but that is wholly
beyond the point here. I did not write 10 pages about the oppressive
nature and brutality of French colonialism, or even mention it, as I did
not think it was needed, as I am not having a discussion with Le Pen
or the ghost of General de Gaulle.

I could of course had written that the sins of the French colonisers
were so great that should burn in eternal hell, and called thse folks
"evildoers ". But I do not think by not doing this, I have "blamed"
the Algerians for French racism, "made the Algerians the villains and
allowed France off the hook, "defended French colonialism, etc.
This is all in your phantasy. We are having a political discussion,
not writing a prelude to Judgement Day.

My interest here have been in the real world results following from
different political courses. Whether I am right or wrong in my con-
clusions, I find this as important as talking about good and bad
intentions, moral resposibility, etc. Acts tend to have unintended
consequences. I seldom find it very interesting to talk about the
morals, "double standards," etc., of our rulers.. That is their problem.
I am not a priest. It find it far for more fruitful to talk about blind
alleys taken by popular movements, as this is far more critical on
the road towards a world beyond capitalism.

And by the way, I do not neither think that Lenin was "wholly
opportunistic," even if did write that,  I rather think he was very
religious and a great believer in Justice, just like Saint-Just.

So to the substance:

Let me start with this troublesome, ambigious  word: Right.
I take it as self-evident that those revolted against French
colonial rule had not right to self-determination. I they had
so had, they could have taken their case to court. Other
than in a juridical sense, I find the term quite meaningless.
"Freedoms ar not given they are taken," wrote on of the old
mens with beard, similarily rights are not something we
have, but something we have the power to impose ot not.

Further, any substantial answers to your question would require
an in-depth study. I will gladly admit that there has gone much
time since this period of French-Algerian history has been
anywhere near the front of my mind.  You can always question
how realistic a civil rights strartegy would have been, even
had it gained massive support. What I will maintain in al cir-
cumstances, is that, had it suceeded, this would also implied
both a better situation for the working classes of Algeria today
and a step forwards for the class struggle in a more global
perspective.


You write: "Frankly, I nowhere see any reason to believe
that France was about to allow Algeria and its citizens full
political rights.  Do you think that the French bourgeois
had any intention of ceding any political power to Algeria,
to millions of Algerians as full French citizens with full
political and social rights?"

No, I don't. The question is if it would have been possible
to impose it on them, and in the process turning their own
stated national ideology (citienzenship founded on liberty,
equality and fraternity ) against them? Could such a strategy
have caused less bloodshed (one million died in the war
for "national self-determination") and given better long
term results? The demand could have been formulated as
full and equal rights within France or, if not, full independence.
Now there is many additional questions linked to this, such
as distribution of land. There are a lot of other objections
that might also be posed. You seem however, have I under-
stood you right, to reject it on principle. But I could be wrong
on this.


"Maybe you would like to tell me how France would
internalize Algeria economically in a non-colonial way?
And do you think France would not enforce French as the
official language?  French colonialism involved the
cultural annihilation of the colonies and a Francification
of the colonies."

These are again all questions of struggle, including the
ideological struggle for the solidarity of as broad a section
of the working class of France.as possible, even of as far
as possible to try to bring a split into the ranks of the settler
colonalist (the lesser ones against the greater ones). Had
one succeeded with the first task, the economically question
might have evolved within a framework of class struggle
more like that between north and south of Italiy and Spain.
There are many unanswered questions here, of course,
given the hypothetical nature of the subject, also due to
that in order to all gain support for this would have involved
a process that would have changed the mindset of both
considerable sections of Algerians, as well as French
workers, and at least a minority of the settler colonialists.

Now we know very well that things did not develop this way.
So what then? This question is very easy. To do whatever
one could do, in this it is no different than during the Vietnam
war, to work against the war and oppression.of the French
state, against French racism, and try to keep in contact with
and strengthen what ever Algerian forces there were with a
more social revolutionary, internationalist perspective. (And
no, I do not blame those who saw this exclusively as a
struggle to get their French oppressors of their back.)

Not a wholly satisfactory answer. That would require far
more. But none the less, I hope I answered some of your
objections, at least.

Harald



















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