From: miked-AT-riseup.net
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:10:35 -0800
Subject: RE: AUT: RE: Research towards an anti-militarist project


Certainly i would never say that the mass outpouring of dissent that we see 
(and are gonna see this weekend) is not inspiring BUT I think we run the very 
real risk of assuming that as we move forward the demos will naturally get 
larger and larger and larger.  Once war starts it is likely in my opinion that 
the demos will start to plateau.  A movement built on preventing a unilateral 
war may not shift as easily as everyone thinks into a movement to stop a war, 
especially if there is any semblance of international governmental support.  We 
also run the risk of assuming that Bush, Blair, etc actually give a shit about 
how big the demos are.  I agree with the idea previously posted that these nice 
non-threatening walks through the city could turn into a ballot box type 
exercise.  that doesn't mean i don't think they should happen, i think they are 
a necessary component of any anti-war movement.  The larger issue i think is 
what comes out of them, whether they can inspire more and more people to take 
active organizing roles not only in anti-war activism but in other areas as 
well.  Which is why I think the point raised in the forward attributed to rob 
about nationalist influences on the movement is important.  I agree with Adrian 
that (at least in my neck of the woods) racist anti-migrant feelings are not 
the predominant ones but equally true is that no border/no one is illegal 
politics are not at the forefront either.  The main focus of my participation 
in this weeks march in toronto will be to talk to as many people as i can and 
hand out as many leaflets as i can inviting people to an ocap demonstration 
against our racist anti-immigrant "minister of public safety and security".  
Hopefully that demonstration when it happens will be linked in people's minds 
with anti-war and hopefully people will be challenged to make connections that 
they wouldn't necessarily make if pro-migrant rights politics aren't put very 
visibly into anti-war activities.  Of course all of this is not to say that 
migrant rights work is the only issue that should be linked.  Later this year 
OCAP will be launching a housing campaign.  many people feel that its a bad 
time to do so because many progressive forces will be so committed to anti-war 
work.  Fuck that.  People are still dying and freezing on the streets of 
toronto while the canadian government today committed to taking over the 
afghanistan mission in order to free up more american troops.  Unions need to 
link workplace struggles to war explicitly, housing activists should link 
millitary spending to social housing spending and so on and so forth.  One 
thing i dislike about the anti-war movement in toronto is that so many 
activists and people seem to have joined anti-war groups rather than 
positioning their existing groups (whether it be a union local or a church 
group or an anarchist affinity group) and their day to day work in relation to 
war.  i would rather see a hodge podge march of various issue based or 
community groups similar to the anti-globalization protests that unite behind 
an anti-war banner than a unified anti-war coalition group.  But perhaps that's 
what is happening in other places?
miked

Quoting Adrian Wilding <adrianwilding-AT-blueyonder.co.uk>:

> Yes, there seems to be an element in the
> popularity of the UK anti-war movement which is simply pro-nationalist,
> or at least pro-UK sovereignty: it merely doesn't want to see a UK
> government as the 'poodle' of Bush. There may also be a - much smaller -
> element which links on an unconscious level Iraq with asylum-seekers and
> wants no part of either. However, I think the size of this constituency
> could easily be over-estimated; I think in fact more people are now
> realising their affinity with 'old Europe'.
> It is also true - and banal - that much of the Stop the War Coalition
> and affiliated groups are not anti-capitalist, and have no class
> analysis (probably because they are themselves 'middle class'...) But on
> Saturday would Rob rather have a march of 50,000 anti-capitalist
> anti-war protestors or 1 million anti-war protestors? I suspect most of
> us, whilst remaining critical and wanting to argue with those going for
> their various 'parochial' reasons, would go for the latter. And this
> because the main aims of this march seems to me 1) getting this war
> stopped (did we somehow forget this?) 2) showing the government that it
> is not supported by the people, 3) changing public opinion 4)
> galvanising anti-imperialist feelings, however diffuse and mis-directed.
> The third point is not unimportant, and doesn't always happen only on
> marches or through internet discussion lists. The many millions who
> watched the 2 hour debate last night on the BBC will have seen Jack
> Straw skinned alive and lucky to leave the auditorium in one piece, the
> overwhelming consensus coming out anti-war. That from a reactionary
> national broadcasting corporation. These things can have an effect. Even
> if not in stopping this current war, but in making sure no future
> government gambles its electability on a policy such as Blair's. Already
> here in Scotland we are seeing a dramatic drop in Labour support ahead
> of elections in April and a shift towards anti-war parties such as the
> Scottish Socialist Party and Green Party. With proportional
> representation, as exists here, these trends are not insignificant. In
> purely party politics terms, these are eventful times. Now, of course we
> must look beyond party politics, and that is why point 3) can be such an
> important after-effect of Saturday. I don't agree with one contributor
> that this sentiment will be soon forgotton. To Rob and his ilk I would
> say: less sectarianism and less fatalism, and lets see what we can
> achieve in the next few weeks.
> Adrian
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-aut-op-sy-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu
> [mailto:owner-aut-op-sy-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu] On Behalf Of Dave
> Graham
> Sent: 13 February 2003 08:43
> To: chris wright
> Cc: aut-op-sy
> Subject: Re: AUT: RE: Research towards an anti-militarist project
> 
> Dear all
> 
> Following the contribution from the OCAP member here is something from
> another list I belong that chimes in and will hopefully provoke more
> 'joined up thinking' along the same lines - actually this is the
> beginning
> of a 'composition' analysis that I thought Autopsy was supposed to be
> about
> [that was for Nate]
> 
> _________________________________________________________
> 
> I think around 25 coaches are going to London for the Stop The War March
> from Nottingham area. Look's like it's going to be a big one. Me I'll be
> in
> Amsterdam. . . there's a big event organised there too!
> 
> ITMT [e-mail for in the meantime?] a thought.
> 
> There's two active campaign type groups in Nottingham at the moment: one
> is
> stopping the War,and the other is working around asylum/anti-deportation
> etc.
> 
> A majority of people oppose the war; nearly half even if there's a
> second
> security council resolution. A much bigger majority oppose asylum
> seekers
> [altho' slightly contradictorily not necessarily the principle of
> asylum].
> 
> Putting aside the organising 'cadre', within the Stop the War 'movement'
> is
> a large dose of parochialism: not a principled opposition to war / US/UK
> intervention but a fear of getting involved with anything East of
> Europe.
> 
> It would be perverse wouldn't it if the effect of StheW was to actually
> help further construct a popular Fortress Europe?
> 
> To clarify: this doesn't mean I'm not 101% in opposition.  
> 
> It might mean that darkness all around is getting to me.
> 
> Interested to know what people think.
> 
> Rob
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Dave Graham
> <davgraham-AT-merseymail.com>
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
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