Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 06:34:17 +0200
From: Martin Hardie <z3118338-AT-student.unsw.edu.au>
Subject: Re: AUT: Hooliganism and class composition -  and Tour de France


Jens

It will be in the Bicycling Australia Tour De France Special issue in 
July 2004.

It is a challenge to write for this audience whilst trying to retain 
something of value and yourself. That is one of the reasons I do it - as 
practice.

Let me wake up now its early

Martin



Kurasje Archive wrote:

>Hi Martin
>
>I just read your story on the Orange Tide and must ask: where did you publish that ? If in some sport magazine or alike I think it is rather well done.
>
>Others here might critize the missing parts, and so do I. But I recognize fully the limits and difficulties of sports journalism if done as 'wage labour' for some commercial paper or journal.
>
>So what is all this euforious obcessions with sports about ?
>
>The 'Orange Tide' of the Basque's is clearly part of the local Spanish nationalist conflict  -  just brought outside Spain and exposed globally for everyone to follow. One of the interesting things in your account is that it came as a surprise for everyone. I.e. it was not prepared and organized as such from the beginning ? I can tell the excact same story about the smaller, but surely enthusiatisc danish followers of Bjarne Riis showin up at the TdF  -  those were the better parts of 'wage labourers' on vacation with family, camping equipment etc. having suddenly a 'purpose' for their travel (other than just eating and drinkning).
>
>I think there is some substitutional culturally 'tribal' mechanisms working here. With all of the 'old workers movement's total collapse not only politically and not only economically (as organs of defending 'wage labour'), but also culturally/ideologically (as somehow honestly expressing the 'conditions of wage labour') workers seek some other collective framwork of expression. Which is then the local 'tribes'  -  the local football-club, the winning sportsman/woman of the region or the successive national team in international games. It is some kind of compensation and it works pretty well.
>
>I don't know either where this thread is going, but let us just see.
>
>Cheers
>
>Jens
>
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: Martin Hardie 
>
>Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 11:15:45 +0200 
>To: aut-op-sy-AT-lists.village.Virginia.EDU 
>Subject: Re: AUT: Hooliganism and class composition - and Tour de France 
>
>  
>
>>Jens 
>>although I could not add anything to the actual conditions in Italy at 
>>the time of the 1948 TdF I enjoyed immensely the stories you posted. 
>>as someone who in one of their other lines/lives is a bit of a cycling 
>>journalist I wonder where we can take this thread. I have tried to use 
>>some of my energy in this regard (sorry in my ciclojourno stuff) to 
>>write somethign about the Basque Country to try and "counter" the 
>>mainstream crap written abut that place. 
>>The latest is for the TdF issue of Bicycling Australia due for 
>>publication in July. Here it is: http://openflows.org/~auskadi/marea.html 
>>I was asked to try and explain
>>    
>>
>  why the Pyrennees turn orange in July - 
>  
>
>>i.e. why are those Basque fans there in such great numbers. Given space 
>>and the audience I tried -don't know if I did though. I was tempted to 
>>call it the Orange Multitude but in the end the Orange Tide seemed better. 
>>You can find them all collected here 
>>http://openflows.org/~auskadi/loungeroom.html (except the most rceent 
>>from the Vuelta al pais vasco from a couple of weeks back - haven't 
>>linked them yet) I suggest maybe the David Etxaberria interview might be 
>>of interest re things Basque and Cycling. 
>>To all those who wonder what this is about - I am merely replying to 
>>Jens spam but there is soemthing intersting in professional sport and 
>>globalisation and compare the mutli national composition of Lance 
>>Armstrong's US Postal team the way that Spanish pro teams re becoming 
>>more tied to local identities than multi nationa
>>    
>>
> l sponsors ...... 
>  
>
>>obviously Euskaltel Euskadi's basque only policy is the "extreme" in 
>>this respect - but to them being Basque is feeling Basque not a 
>>question of blood or birth. 
>>Best to all 
>>you can guess who i would liek to win the Tour! 
>>Martin 
>>
>>
>>
>>Kurasje Archive wrote: 
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Hi there, 
>>>
>>>I'm not much into this recomposition-project, but more general into the fundamental and 'never' (?!) changing constituent class relationship of wage labour as such. It might be that the phenomenons change and I am fully in favor of disploring such matters. But I like to keep historical proportions and save from the past what is worth remembering and of use to a coming gathering of everything and everybody in the 'grand finale'. 
>>>
>>>As to the phenomenons of sports and entertainments as source for ideological capturing of workers discontents wi
>>>      
>>>
> thin the limits of the existing social order I don't think that there is any special change fundamentally throughout the history of capitalism. 
>  
>
>>>There is of course a continous change in the means and scope of such ideological collective 'mass-events'. And I can understand and support your effort to try to link the phenomenon of football-hooliganism somehow to the defeat of various branches of the English working class in the 80'ies. That might be so. 
>>>
>>>But the underlying and working constituences here are not a question of this specific phase of British capitalism or of any attached 'recomposition of the working class'. Such factors can only be seen as stimulating and aggravating impulses to mechanisms and potentials already existing within the general constitution of capitalism and thus within the general constitution of the working class - no matter what the era. 
>>>
>>>And so for your project: 
>>>      
>>>
>  > 
>  
>
>>>You are focussed on nowadays 'hooliganism' - which is ok and needs some investigations - surely. 
>>>
>>>The question is however why and how such 'public' events in the 'free time' of the workers can produce such an amount of energy and participation ? 
>>>
>>>And the next question is if not this has always been so - within the epoke of capitalism (or even within all previous class societies) ? 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>With this I will also like to announce my usual and coming summer 'spamming' concerning the Tour de France Bicycle-race: 
>>>
>>>What was actually going on in the northern of Italy as reaction on the assault on Togliati in 1948 ? 
>>>
>>>Was there anywhere some radical initiatives to take over (local) control of society ? 
>>>
>>>Or was the whole event just a scene of 'hooliganism' in another context (another compositi
>>>      
>>>
> on if you like) ? 
>  
>
>>>And how could the Italian winning of the Tour by Gino Bartali contribute to the norminalization of the whole event ? 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>In this mail I will only give you the links to the 'spammings' from last year: 
>>>
>>>http://lists.village.virginia.edu/cgi-bin/spoons/archive_msg.pl?file=aut-op-sy.archive/aut-op-sy.0307&msgnum=16&start=2124&end=2215 
>>>
>>>http://lists.village.virginia.edu/cgi-bin/spoons/archive_msg.pl?file=aut-op-sy.archive/aut-op-sy.0307&msgnum=17&start=2216&end=2290 
>>>
>>>http://lists.village.virginia.edu/cgi-bin/spoons/archive_msg.pl?file=aut-op-sy.archive/aut-op-sy.0307&msgnum=18&start=2291&end=2350 
>>>
>>>http://lists.village.virginia.edu/cgi-bin/spoons/archive_msg.pl?file=aut-op-sy.archive/aut-op-sy.0307&msgnum=43&start=7306&end=7387 
>>>      
>>>
> > 
>  
>
>>>I promise to be back on this amd encourage everyone - especially from Italy - to contribute. 
>>>
>>>For now 
>>>
>>>Jens 
>>>
>>>www.kurasje.org 
>>>
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: john 
>>>
>>>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 06:47:02 +0100 
>>>To: aut-op-sy-AT-lists.village.Virginia.EDU 
>>>Subject: Re: AUT: Hooliganism and class composition 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>On 15 Apr 2004, at 13:52, Anthony iles wrote: 
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>Namely I would like to propose the phenomenon of football 
>>>>>hooliganism, other forms of class delinquency and its attendant cycle 
>>>>>of media hysteria as a parallel narrative to the defeat of 'heroic' 
>>>>>labour in the miners struggle in 1980's Britain. 
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>
>  
>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>But football hooliganism predates the 80s, and was rife during 70s. 
>>>>Perhaps the class composition changed, perhaps the narratives: the 
>>>>portrayal moved from lumpen skinheads in the 70s/early 80s to affluent 
>>>>"nouveau riche" casuals during the 80s boom. 
>>>>
>>>>John 
>>>>
>>>>svejk's scrapbook 
>>>>www.svejk.org 
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>--- from list aut-op-sy-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu --- 
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>-- 
>>http://www.auskadi.tk/ 
>>"the riddle which man must solve, he can only solve in being, in 
>>being what he is and not something else...." 
>>    
>>
> 
>  
>
>>
>>--- from list aut-op-sy-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu --- 
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>  
>


-- 
http://www.auskadi.tk/
"the riddle which man must solve, he can only solve in being, in 
being what he is and not something else...."



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