Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 16:23:18 +0000 From: Colin Wight <Colin.Wight-AT-aber.ac.uk> Subject: Re: BHA: Adorno on style Hi Ruth, A few quick fire millennium responses. And yes you are probably right you shouldn't have done it. But as a Prolegomena of my own, let's remember Aristotle's argument that we should only expect as much clarity as the object allows. (not that I want to fall on the side of defending RBs prose - well not always anyhow) >Yes, Adorno goes on and on about the inherent impossibility of a certain >kind of precision, clarity or transparency -- and the violence that is >implied by the unselfconscious pursuit thereof. But this is because, for >Adorno, thought itself is compromised, in a way that it is not for Bhaskar. See Aristotle above. For RB the problem resides not in thought, or simply the problems expressing such thought, but in the complexity of what thought attempts to grasp. > >[True, there is also the oppposition from Adorno to cognitive operations >that are simply too easy. This objection is one of the elements of his >critique of popular culture and of the culture industry as a whole -- Adorno >doesn't like jazz, for example, for this reason. Adorno doesn't like Jazz becuase it is a cognitive operation that is too easy!!!!! Obviously never tried to play any...And certainly can't have listened to much. > >In any case, rightly or wrongly Adorno would shudder at a philosophy of >science in which scientists are thought of as identifying (althethic) >truths. Well, Ruth, I don't think this is RB's concept either. Scientists NEVER identify alethic truths. Rather we should say alethic truths are what they ATTEMPT to grasp, but since RB is highly critical of all forms of identity thinking the grasping can never be that which it attempt to grasp. All knowledge claims remember are potentially fallible. But the existence of alethic truths helps explain what scientists do. He would also be opposed to the account of language and meaning >encapsulated in the concept of referential detachment. Why? I don't follow this. And that's not to >mention the whole notion of a transcendental realism -- which Adorno, I >suspect, would chalk up to so much pre-Kantian metaphysics! Probably would, but then so do most positivists and many others. > >My point is only that Adorno's views on style *ARE*, for better or for >worse, related to the content of his critique of idealism in all of its >forms -- and it matters, I think, that this critique would extend to RB's >critical realism. RB, conversely, does not, as I understand him, hold any >views about thought, language and/or "objects" that preclude the pursuit of >stylistic clarity. Well on this of course - if idealism be the enemy - we can invoke Aristotle. For Adorno's position can only be that simplicity is a function only of us (idealism), whereas for RB if the world is complex then its description will be likewise complex. And the Kant issue, well fine words indeed, but how far does he succeed and still maintain the integrity of the argument? Anyway, in the final analysis it is not really a matter of style, but whether the ideas could be communicated in a more "user friendly manner". Now, I think many of RBs later works could (I say later becuase it seems to me that RTS, PON, PIF, SRHE, RR are all perfectly clear) be expounded more clearly, but note, this is not to say that RB could write them any more clearly. Some people, after all, have a gift (whether socially acquired or not) for clear writing, some don't. And to say that RB had it in his earlier books does not mean that he has it now. Anyway, I have to say, invoking Adorno to critique RB on style is very much pan calling kettle territory. Adorno a model of clarity is he? Cheers, Happy New Year. P.S. You should all run out and buy Andrew Sayers new book "realism and social science" (Sage, 2000) it is a great intro to CR and very good for undergrads for those mad enough (hands up!) to try and teach some CR concepts. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Dr. Colin Wight Department of International Politics University of Wales Aberystwyth telephone: +44 (0)1970-621769 fax : +44 (0)1970-622709 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- from list bhaskar-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu ---
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