File spoon-archives/deleuze-guattari.archive/deleuze-guattari_1998/deleuze-guattari.9810, message 170


Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 09:34:56 -0500
From: pierre cyr <pbcyr-AT-auburn.campus.mci.net>
Subject: Re: how the real world became that punk-o-lantern smile!


Tim Dennis wrote:
> 
> where could i find that nietzsche passage?
> 
> thanks
> 
> Daniel Haines wrote:
> 
> > Jon Rubin wrote:
> >
> > > Yeah, but Baudrillard just nicked this from Nietzsche's "How the Real
> > > World Finally Became a Myth" (I think thats its title - near enough) and
> > > made it less funny - which is my main objection, though if you only find
> > > it "sort of useful" (simulation of use?) maybe there is another...
> > > J
> >
> > when it comes to the whole postmodern/ signs/ baudrillard area, i think
> > that the passage in Nietzsche you mention is more interesting than
> > almost anything else I've read!    the clarity with which he breaks down
> > the logic of negation is really incredible.  from memory (and not with
> > particular clarity!)it runs something like
> >
> > de-value lived existence / affirm an unlived-unlivable existence as
> > desirable/negate the lived as therefore undesirable/ deny the lived
> > "reality" because of its undesirability/ affirm the unlived as the
> > "real" lived... make the unlived the lived, and the lived therefore
> > unlived, impossible to live - !
> >
> > ( tell desire what it desires is no good/beat it into phantasy/ tell it
> > it lacks and always will, that it cannot be satisfied/ tell it desire
> > and everything it desires is false and  treacherous therefore not real/
> > tell it only phantasy is the reality of desire - and that phantasy  is
> > impossible, is always unsatisfying - but desirable...)
> >
> > to which i suppose we should add - and we'll make sure you make sure you
> > are living/desiring what we approve of...
> >
> > there's a fabulous passage in Zarathustra where N. parodies Schopenhauer
> > as a prophet of doom, and he delivers a grim picture of the state of the
> > world - it is very pm/Baudrillard...  and Z's reaction is, i think, very
> > instructive ...
> >
> > dan h.
> >
> > --
> > Ware ware Karate-do o shugyo surumonowa,
> > Tsuneni bushido seishin o wasurezu,
> > Wa to nin o motte nashi,
> > Soshite tsutomereba kanarazu tasu.
> >
> > We who study Karate-do,
> > Should never forget the spirit of the samurai,
> > With peace, perseverance and hard work,
> > We will reach our goal without failure.
Tim, 
	You can find 'How the Real World Finally Became a Fable' in Nietzsche's
*Twilight of the Idols*.  You may or may not also be interested in
Derrida's reading of this passage - particularly the bit about truth/the
real world/the idea  becoming a woman - in his book *Spurs: Nietzsche's
Styles*, which also looks at the question of simulation.

Sin-cyr-ly,
	Pierre Cyr
	pbcyr-AT-auburn.campus.mci.net

   

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