From: "Anthony Crifasi" <crifasi-AT-hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Proof that New France is Old Europe
Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 06:07:38 +0000


Besides all the issues your raise, John: whether your comparisons between 
past US action and the Nazis are valid, whether your comparisons between 
current Israeli action and the Nazis are valid, whether you even know Bush's 
"attitudes regarding anything and everything," whether there is more 
"disunity" in the US than in any other place, whether the US economy is 
anywhere NEAR as dire as you suggest, whether Bush is the devil himself by 
starting a war to divert attention from other issues, and most outrageous of 
all, that current internal US problems are more serious than problems in 
either new OR OLD Europe (!!!!!!!!)...

...besides all that, which I could address point by point without ever 
getting to the current Iraq situation, let's deal with the one thing you say 
that is directly relevant to the point at hand:

>Iraq has apparently 'disarmed' since 1991,
>and there is no evidence of a 'material breach' of
>'disclosure' and presence of weapons of 'mass destruction'.

And for the second time I ask you: HAVE YOU READ UN RESOLUTION 1441?

Specifically, paragraphs 3 and 4. There, you will find two criteria for a 
material breach: either (1) any lack in their declaration of weapons which 
was submitted at the end of last year, or (2) any lack of full cooperation 
in the implementation of the resolution. Regarding #1, the inspectors have 
already found items specifically listed in paragraph #3 of the resolution 
that were not included in Iraq's declaration of weapons last year, including 
the discovery in just the past few days of missiles with long range 
capability. Regarding #2, Hans Blix himself has said that Iraq far from 
giving the inspectors full cooperation, ESPECIALLY REGARDING INTERVIEWS WITH 
SCIENTISTS.

So for the SECOND time, John, please read the definition of a material 
breach in resolution 1441 before simply asserting that there has been no 
material breach.

Anthony Crifasi





>From: John Foster <borealis-AT-mercuryspeed.com>
>Reply-To: heidegger-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu
>To: heidegger-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu
>Subject: Re: Proof that New France is Old Europe
>Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 12:02:40 -0800
>
>
>Subject: Fw: Proof that New France is Old Europe
>
>
>FYI
>
>Anthony wrote:
>
>In this article, Thomas Sowell makes hash of Robert Fisk's
>ridiculous
>statement that the current French attitude does not
>represent the "Old
>Europe". How quickly we forget history, when Heidegger
>emphasized it so.
>
>John here:
>
>There are many similarities between the Nazi's and the US
>Government, especially if 'history' is assessed from a body
>count perspective. You get the point: Dresden, Nagasaki,
>Hiroshima ( all causalties were civilians), and then so
>forth to Vietnam/IndoChina (2.5 million dead civilians), etc
>cetera. Where the Nazi's used 'gas' and 'starvation', the US
>has used 'napalm', 'nuclear radiation', 'Agent Orange',
>'depleted uranium' as well as 'land mines' and many other
>novel forms of killing. These last forms of killing are the
>United States specialty, including 'carpet bombing' lately.
>
>I am not sure what is meant by "old Europe" but I do know
>what is meant by "old America". The Old America is a
>thinking style epitomized by Pres. Bush's attitudes and
>propositions regarding anything and everything. In his
>presendential campaign speech he made the point that if he
>was elected president that he would go to Mexico and "take
>the oil."
>
>Funny thing is that there are terrorists operating almost
>each day in Israel, bombing and killing dozens of innocent
>people. The largest backer of the terrorism of course in the
>region is the USA, which funds Israel and it's military.
>
>Now if Israel had lots of oil, then there would be a major
>war in Israel, Jordon and Palestine. The US, when it was
>attacked by terrorists in NYC, was not attacked by
>foreigners, but rather by American citizens, some of whom
>were immigrants from countries in the middle east. It is not
>surprizing that there are immigrants in both US and in
>Canada. In fact, Toronto has over 49% of it's citizenship
>comprised of immigrants, folks who were born in a country
>other than Canada. Toronto has over 3 million people
>according to the most recent census. Is there any 'disunity'
>in this country? or any others?
>
>It seems to me that if there is 'disunity' in the world,
>that it is in the US, not in any other place.
>
>Let us look at the current social, economic and political
>situation in the US. Low inflation, low interest rates, and
>no growth. High energy costs, and a 3 year fit of constant
>stock market declines (generally believed to have exceeded
>the length of any in history). Where there is no preception
>of profits, there is no net investment. Where there is no
>perception of profits, there are few new investments.
>
>Bushites did not win the popular vote in the US. The
>Bushites need to divert attention from humanitarian issues
>in Israel and Palestine in order to maintain popular support
>for their regime.
>
>The Bushites are attempting to stage a drama and revive
>latent "American" patriotism in order to maintain political
>credibility....If the Bushites do not succeed at reviving
>the pulse and throb of the patriotic heart, then it will be
>difficult for the US population to ignore much more serious
>internal economic and social problems. The Bushites need a
>'showdown' or 'countdown' drama displayed in the
>media....The fact that innocent people may be injured and
>killed in Baghdad makes little difference to the US
>Congress, and there is certainly no reason to suspect that
>'difference' will in the near future, as long as there is
>some 'patriotic action' outside the country.
>
>Recently there was a murder at a Washington, DC, gas
>station. Witnesses did not even 'bother' to call the police.
>The homicide rate in this 'nations' capital is the highest
>in the world (30 years statistics located in the World
>Almanac, NYC.) The explanation for not reporting a murder in
>Washington, DC., is relatively simple: it is too dangerous
>there to 'testify' against murderers. So why bother at all
>to report a death? If a witness, then a dead or injured
>witness in Washington, DC.
>
>The problems "internal" within the US are much more serious
>than the social and economic problems in Europe, old or new.
>The Bushters though know this and have decided to focus on a
>'win-win' situation in 'old Iraq' or 'new Iraq' depending on
>vantage point. Iraq has apparently 'disarmed' since 1991,
>and there is no evidence of a 'material breach' of
>'disclosure' and presence of weapons of 'mass destruction'.
>The US will 'win' by taking the oil, and the Republicans
>will 'win' if they dispose of Saddam Hussein. The obvious
>problem now is convincing others in the world who want to
>take a more peaceful approach to solving problems in the
>Middle East. Who is advocating using weapons of mass
>destruction though now?
>
>The US has stated that it will use 'nuclear weapons' in Iraq
>if it has too, and as well it has used 'depleted uranium' in
>both Afghanistan and in Iraq in the late 1980's. In the Gulf
>War the US used bombers and killed over 200,000 fleeing
>troops during a carpet bombing spree which won it a world
>record not equalled since Dresden was bombed into
>unrecognition at the end of world war 2.
>
>Does history repeat itself? Well yes it does. The history
>and destiny of being an American soldier is much the same as
>it was in Vietnam, as it was in the Gulf War. Some of these
>men and women will be killed in action, and some will die a
>painful death later due to 'poison' in the bones.
>
>These American soldiers are not working for a wage which
>will support their families, but rather they will be working
>to become martyrs for a unjust cause. When in the history of
>the last 50 years has the US military ever really took all
>precaution and spared a single civilian life when it fought
>in a foreign country?
>
>jmf
>
>
>
>
>
>==============>Thomas Sowell
>Disarming a country
>1/30/03
>
>
>History does not literally repeat itself, but sometimes it
>comes awfully
>close. Iraq is not the first dangerous dictatorship that
>international
>agreements tried to keep disarmed. Nor is it the first where
>that effort
>failed.
>
>
>
>
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