File spoon-archives/lyotard.archive/lyotard_2002/lyotard.0203, message 54


Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 18:38:29 +1000
From: hbone <hbone-AT-optonline.net>
Subject: Re: totalizing


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Re: totalizing
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Lois Shawver 
  To: lyotard-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu 
  Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 7:22 AM
  Subject: RE: totalizing

  Yes, it is very similar.  I tried though, to emphasize that our scientific knowledge of the human animal, indicates far more complexity than was known to W and others about seventy years ago.  I think meanings arise from memory/learning - life-history, experiences, memories are different for each individual, and that memory is the source of meanings.  This is personal opinion of course, but I don't think it really contradicts what you and the others are saying here.

  Thanks,
  Hugh


  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


  Hugh, you say, "My interpretation of Lyotard and Wittgenstein (and Alice in Wonderland) is that a word or words, such as "totalizing" means what those who use it mean it to mean. 

  Of course.  Wittgenstein really points the way for how an author can explain the meaning of the way a term is used in her own writing when he introduces the term "language game" (aphorism #7) in the Philosphical Investigations.    Don't you think it serves as a good model? (Refresh your reading.  this is the last part of aphorism #7)
   
  7 We can also think of the whole process 
  of using words in (2) as one of those games 
  by means of which children learn their native 
  language. I will call these games 
  "language-games" and will sometimes speak 
  of a primitive language as a language-game. 
   
  And the processes of naming the stones and 
  of repeating words after someone might also 
  be called language-games. Think of much of 
  the use words in games like ring-a-ring-a-roses. 
   
  I shall also call the whole, consisting of language 
  and the actions into which it is woven, the "language-game". 

  Of course, people like Lyotard, Kripke, Hugh, Lois, Judy,  pick up the term and change the meaning slightly (at times at least). Otherwise, it will all be very simple, wouldn't it?  And the logical positivists would have won the war that still goes on between different factions.Everything could be tied down to definitions.
   
  But in their place we need not place nothing at all (unless we want to leave our terms undefined). Wecan follow Wittgenstein's lead and explain how we each usethe term, and talk a little about the differences and similarities between the way we use the term and the way others use the term.
   
  I take it this is similar to what you were saying?
   
  ..Lois Shawver
   

--Boundary_(ID_Pa033cxv0SiNnY4d6SI6ZA)

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Re: totalizing
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Lois Shawver
To: lyotard-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu
Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 7:22 AM
Subject: RE: totalizing
 
Yes, it is very similar.  I tried though, to emphasize that our scientific knowledge of the human animal, indicates far more complexity than was known to W and others about seventy years ago.  I think meanings arise from memory/learning - life-history, experiences, memories are different for each individual, and that memory is the source of meanings.  This is personal opinion of course, but I don't think it really contradicts what you and the others are saying here.
 
Thanks,
Hugh
 
 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hugh, you say, "My interpretation of Lyotard and Wittgenstein (and Alice in Wonderland) is that a word or words, such as "totalizing" means what those who use it mean it to mean. 
Of course.  Wittgenstein really points the way for how an author can explain the meaning of the way a term is used in her own writing when he introduces the term "language game" (aphorism #7) in the Philosphical Investigations.    Don't you think it serves as a good model? (Refresh your reading.  this is the last part of aphorism #7)
 
7 We can also think of the whole process
of using words in (2) as one of those games
by means of which children learn their native
language. I will call these games
"language-games" and will sometimes speak
of a primitive language as a language-game.
 
And the processes of naming the stones and
of repeating words after someone might also
be called language-games. Think of much of
the use words in games like ring-a-ring-a-roses.
 
I shall also call the whole, consisting of language
and the actions into which it is woven, the "language-game".
Of course, people like Lyotard, Kripke, Hugh, Lois, Judy,  pick up the term and change the meaning slightly (at times at least). Otherwise, it will all be very simple, wouldn't it?  And the logical positivists would have won the war that still goes on between different factions.Everything could be tied down to definitions.
 
But in their place we need not place nothing at all (unless we want to leave our terms undefined). Wecan follow Wittgenstein's lead and explain how we each usethe term, and talk a little about the differences and similarities between the way we use the term and the way others use the term.
 
I take it this is similar to what you were saying?
 
..Lois Shawver
 
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