File spoon-archives/lyotard.archive/lyotard_2003/lyotard.0304, message 70


From: gvcarter-AT-purdue.edu
Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 13:58:01 -0500
Subject: Re: unconscious, dreams, and memory ..



Hugh/All, 

Greg Ulmer's essay "Sounding the unconscious," in a work he put together with 
Derrida called the "GLASsary," makes interesting work of making the unconscious 
accessible.  Instead of regarding the unconscious as a "mystery," as Hugh puts 
it, he puns that word into a heurestic strategy call the "my-story."

The premise of a Mystory is to set up writing conditions for chance to take 
place.  Instead of "Give Peace a chance," one might consider Ulmer's work to 
forward the notion of "Give Chance a Chance." 

Ulmer's working w/ Derrida/Freud, in my estimation, seems to challenge the 
notion you forward concerning the "conscious mind" as a site of "retrievable 
memories."  Ulmer's Applied Grammatology suggests to me that that which is 
retrievable" is as doubtful as that which is "transmittable" (i.e. Derrida's 
challenge to Searl/Sarl in Limited Inc. suggests that the notion 
of "iterability" necessarily involves a change in code and that ideas never 
come across "clear" or "transparent" as the sovereign self might think.)

The Unconcious vis-a-vis Derrida, then, becomes a site where memory is doubtful 
of its self; it is the necessarily "stupid" self (see Ronell).  It is that 
which is retrieved from storage is continuous changed, no matter how 
transparent Proust's articulation of memory may appear in Remembrance of Things 
Past.  (This is, perhaps, a reductive reading of Proust, but I will forward the 
example of Raymond Roussel who--in addition to living next door to Proust--
engaged in practice of continously displacing language as he tried to write his 
novel.  The result is a collection of associative sound-words that, though 
cryptic, follow a heurestic that I would contend has some bearing on Ulmer-
Derrida-and the unconscious.)

The result of all this is a notion of what Ulmer calls the "puncept."  (I call 
it "sound reasoning," to also capture various senses and to subvert one of the 
criticisms often leveled concerning these ideas.   For example:  "Are you sure 
this is sound reasoning on your part?"  "Yes!"  =)

Now, I suspect Hugh (Pronounced: "You" =) may still be skeptical of such a 
state.  Hugh, in fact, mentions the "half awake/half asleep" stage which is 
undecidable.  This liminal space is very interesting, from my perspective, 
because it seems to confront one of Levinas's injunctions AGAINST 
Derrida's "sound reasoning."  For Levinas locates il y a in, among other 
places, "insomnia."  One may well ask, where is the so-called sub-conscious for 
the insomniac?  To that charge, and a host of other injunctions 
concerning "playing w/ language" and "catching laughter in one's throat" 
(rather than inadvertedly laughing at the other), I have more questions than 
answers, but I offer this example as this "half awake/half asleep" statement 
may share in Levinas's reserve.  

In any case, Hugh, at the end of your message you speak out for a "consensus" 
for the either a psychic or philosophical "unconscious."  I'm thinking that 
they're one in the same, and moreover I don't think that the "consensus" you 
speak of is possible to achieve, "psychically speaking."

Psychically speaking = Sound Reasoning  

best,

Geof
       



Quoting hbone <hbone-AT-optonline.net>:

> Eric/All,
> 
> I don't remember saying dreams are non-existent.
> 
> Another opinion you might not agree with:
> 
> Since the unconscious is not accessible to consciousness it is a mystery,
> like belief. 
> Belief in science or religion is approached with evidence and faith.  Lack of
> evidence in religion does not mean lack of faith.  What an individual
> believes to be the case "is the case" for that individual.  If one believes
> poison or fall from great height will kill, that is "reality", and one acts
> accordingly.  
> 
> I wonder what newborns dream of.  They sense pain and hunger, but must learn
> (absorb into their minds, memory, muscles) the ability to recognize faces and
> words, and make purposeful movement of their limbs.
> 
> If we knew their dreams, we might have a Freudian concept of their
> Unconscious.  Before the enfant learns words and images, and other objects of
> the senses, flashes of light and strange noises would seem to have no
> meaning.  I've read that people blind at birth whose sight is restored by
> surgery have to be taught to "see"..
> 
> I can't argue with your authorities.  I know nothing of their unconscious nor
> of yours.  I''ve been conscious of dreams that waked me.  I am not usually
> conscious of breathing, digestion, blood flow, etc.whether asleep or awake,
> if all is normal.  Those systems and the sleeping brain do things without our
> conscious knowledge, but that's not the unconscious that Freud glorified.
> 
> Before Freud, perhaps more mystical narratives were built from religion than
> any other source.  Just read the Bible, or other religious books. They tell
> great tales about the unknown in much the same way Freud told great tales of
> the unconscious.
>  
> The religious writers were very productive:  Heaven and Hell, Eternal bliss
> or damnation, Death and Transfiguration, books of revelation.
> 
> To have a conscious mind is to have retrievable memories. 
> 
> Freud's concept of THE "unconscious" seems to have been based on memory and
> forgetting, especially the inability to forget terrible memories that can
> interfere with mental processes, attitudes, will-to-live.  
> 
> The war-damaged, shell-shock condition, for example, ruins lives every time
> there's a war.
>   .  
> In his time, Freud found  that people could be seriously damaged by thoughts
> of sex and by guilt   They were prisoners of memories and dreams they
> couldn't forget.  Talking with a psychiatrist could help. 
> 
> A lot of things about sex and guilt that got much attention when Freud 
> became famous are not so fearsome and mystical now - almost a century
> later..
> 
> Remembering dreams is a conscious act.  Do unconscious acts produce
> memories?
> Is one unconscious while dreaming?  Sometimes I feel half awake, half asleep.
>  Consciously or unconsciously. 
> 
> Scientists say sleep eases tensions, rests and refreshes the brain and
> memories. Part of that process is dreaming.  But war victims and others seem
> to reach a level of stress that destroys the recuperative function of
> sleeping and dreaming.
> 
> To summarize, I think psychiatry has its uses, that the unconscious brain
> manages our bodies, and theories of  a psychic or philosophical unconscious
> or other unknowns should be treated as such until there is evidence and
> consensus to confirm them.
> 
> best,
> Hugh.
> 
>  
> 
> ~^*~^*^~*~*~*~^*~^~*^~*~^
> 
> 
> Hugh wrote:
>    
> 
>   The Unconscious that by definition is not knowable, leads to boredom.
> 
>    
> 
>   Hugh, 
> 
>    
> 
>   Thanks for sharing this vastly important insight.  Now I realize how wrong
> Freud and Lacan were and that dreams are nonexistent.
> 
>    
> 
>   I suppose that by the same definition you mean to imply that the
> consciousness is knowable by default and that nothing exists outside of your
> consciousness.
> 
>    
> 
>   Finally, an end to ennui!
> 
>    
> 
>   eric
> 
>    
> 
>    
> 
>    
> 




   

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