Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:56:08 +0000
From: "steve.devos-AT-krokodile.co.uk" <steve.devos-AT-krokodile.co.uk>
Subject: Re: post hegelian slumber....post madrid awakening


Hugh said : "...Postmodern Europe, like Israel/Palestine seems committed 
to surviving religious terrorism whether its is deployed as tanks, 
copters, planes, or dynamite belts, back-packs...."

I do wonder where and why you developed this impression, because it is 
in complete contradiction to the real.

[Let me just emphasize especially for those who don't know about the 
long ongoing history of 'terrorism' in western europe, that terrorism 
has been an ongoing feature of our social and political life - and will 
continue to be for the foreseeable future. Any person who imagines 
otherwise is ignoring our recent history.]

steve


hbone wrote:

>
>
>  
>
>>Eric/all
>>
>>As requested some notes on the aftermath of Madrid seen from here..
>>
>>The political shock waves from the terrorist actions in Spain/Madrid are
>>echoing across Europe. But it seems likely that the event will not be
>>bringing Europe and America closer together, for even though sizable
>>terrorist actions have now taken place on both sides of the Atlantic,
>>the actual result of the attack may widen the strategic gap between
>>America and Europe.
>>
>>The neo-liberal and neo-conservative theory was that once Europe had
>>been roused from its post-Hegelian slumber, with inbuilt multilateralist
>>dreams. With the resultant  European appeasement ways being seen to be a
>>theoretical mistake. That it would then begin to appreciate and accept
>>the Hobbesian reality of a world where security depends on military
>>might. At this oint the theory went that the west would unite under the
>>threat of Islamic extremism, as it had done under the threat of Soviet
>>invasion. But of course after Madrid, Europe is no closer to this view
>>rather idiotic misinterpretation of events.
>>
>>We are two full-scale 'wars'  in, Afghanistan and Iraq and countless
>>anti-terrorist operations, but all of these events have failed to
>>convince most Europeans that this war, as understood is winnable.
>>Western intelligence agencies were completely unaware of the the Madrid
>>attacks. They had expected electronic "chatter" and rumours of an
>>imminent strike from information intercepts. There were absolutely none.
>>(as if a terrorist soes not also see Hollywood movies...) The security
>>people mistakenly told us  that al-Qaida was weakened and that
>>consequently it could only mount attacks soft targets outside of the G20
>>countries in Bali, Istanbul and Tunisia. That proved to be a dangerous
>>miscalculation. What happened to the theory - that the front line in
>>Iraq would draw all jihadists to a sticky end? Al-Qaida, is still there
>>alive and kicking, and so probably is Osama bin Laden (possible future
>>ruler of Saudi Arabia?). The bombings of last week have shown that the
>>"crusader" targets are as vulnerable or more so as they were
>>two-and-a-half years ago, when the Twin Towers were levelled.
>>
>>As the Hegelian and post-Hegelian would say in concert - the
>>anti-terrorist events have merely encoraged them - why is it that the
>>Hobbesian's are so superficial ?
>>
>>
>>steve
>>
>>
>>
>>--- StripMime Warning --  MIME attachments removed ---
>>This message may have contained attachments which were removed.
>>
>>Sorry, we do not allow attachments on this list.
>>
>>--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---
>>multipart/alternative
>>  text/plain (text body -- kept)
>>  text/html
>>---
>>    
>>
>
>
>  
>


--- StripMime Warning --  MIME attachments removed --- 
This message may have contained attachments which were removed.

Sorry, we do not allow attachments on this list.

--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- 
multipart/alternative
  text/plain (text body -- kept)
  text/html
---