Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 13:51:53 +0100 (MET)
From: rolf.martens-AT-mailbox.swipnet.se (Rolf Martens)
Subject: Re: M-G: The Debate On China


Jay (Detcom) wrote, on 14.12
(and this is a second reply by me today, with some - to
me - new information in a book I recently read):

>Rolf, I have been thinking hard and doing a lot of
>study around the issue of the "gang of four" and
>the restoration of capitalism in China of late since
>your suggestion of a debate around these things was
>posted to the list.  Of late I have been reading later
>issues of Peking Review (after 1976) and studying the
>political lines of Hua Kuo-feng and Deng Hsaio-ping
>presented as interviews in these publications.  I
>think I can demonstrate from the facts that you are
>holding a number of erroneous ideas concerning the
>events, persons, and political lines involved in
>the Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution.

As I wrote in my first reply today, it will interest me
much to see your arguments for that. This *is* a very
important debate, I hold!

..........

>I want also to touch upon some other things you have brought
>up in many of your articles on China, such as your statements
>that the masses were overjoyed with the arrests of Chiang
>Ching and the others;

Yes, the documents I brought in my Info #22en, to this list
on 03.11.96, show that. And so do others. I'm certain that
this was so, quite generally. In one of your postings, Jay,
in April on this, when we did start some dicussion on it, you
among other things wrote about struggles breaking out, and
"especially in Shanghai", which I then wrote was not the
case, and I asked you about your sources for this. On any
struggles at all taking place at *that* time, in October 1976
(as opposed to later, in the beginning of 1977, when the
Deng clique was gaining power), I had then gotten no
information at all. In Shanghai, obviously, there *was*
great joy at the striking down of the 4-Gang, which supposedly
had their power base there. And the same e.g. in Beijing.

But I recently read a little in a book that does contain
some information, which appears reliable, on certain struggles
in some places, including one not far from Shanghai. Here I shall
quote some lines from it.

It's by Gunnar H=E4ggl=F6f, Swedish diplomat, who was in the Soviet
Union in the 1930:s (and has much interesting information from
that period in other books of his) and who was later ambassador
of Sweden to that country. He visited China in the autumn of
1977 and wrote the book "Kina som jag s=E5g det" ("China as I saw
it"), 190 pages, published in 1978, ISBN 91-1-783282-9. I'm
quoting here (in translation) from pages 124-125 of that book:

"Wang [Wang Hongwen, one of the 4-Gang - RM] had long cultivated
his connections with the militia in different parts of China and
in particular in Shanghai. He is said to have once said: 'with
a hundred thousand workers and a million of militia men, Shanghai
can dominate the whole country'. If he really had made such a
statement, it would have shown unusually bad judgement. When the
news of the arrest of the four reached Shanghai, there - according
to the testimony of a visiting American - arose an atmosphere of
veritable celebration."

[That "visiting American" is most probably, I think, the same
professor from the USA whose account was quoted in Klaus Mehnert's
book and reproduced by me in part 6/12 of my posting on the 4-Gang,
Info #22en. So, I have no other foreign witnesses so far on this.
Here comes what was new to me, in H=E4ggl=F6f's book:]

"However, it can be seen from reports by local radio stations that
disturbances had occurred in many places. From Hunan and Shansi
there was reported "open revolt" and from Szechuan "civil war".
It is generally known that long-lasting and serious strife had
occurred in Hangchow. Of this I heard during my visit to
Shanghai, which of course is rather close to Hangchow."

"It apparently on a few occasions was the case that the regional
units of the Chinese army had to call in troops from
neighbouring provinces, but any really critical situation does
not seem to have arisen anywhere. It was simply a question of
time when the army could restore calm and order everywhere."

"Hua had behind himself the regular army and all security and
police forces. The 'Gang of Four' had only scattered militia
troops and groups of other adherents, who, it is true, seem to
have been numerous at some places but who were largely unarmed."

So it appears that the 4-Gang did have some adherents among
the masses in some places. This doesn't change my overall
assessment though: The Chinese people and those activists who
really wanted to uphold Mao Zedong's line were *ground between
the two millstones of two reactionary groupings* which were
opposing each other too and which were pretending, both of
them, to be the representative of the correct line but which
in fact were both opposing Mao Zedong's line. It's not
unreasonable to suppose that a certain number of people were
fooled by the phoney"radical" propaganda of the 4-Gang, or/and
that in some places, the striking down of that Gang was being
presented as a "victory for Deng's line", which it in fact was
*not*, in the country as a whole.

And it remains a fact, I hold - and it's supported by many
accounts - that, in their great majority, the Chinese people
did enthusiastically welcome the striking down of the 4-Gang.
The accounts I've reproduced so far - except for the official one,
which I've given my reasons for judging to be veracious - are the
one from Shanghai and the one from Tsingtao (as it was spelled
then). There are others too. 

Later, from early 1977 on, there were reports in the (openly)
bourgeois newspapers of "disturbances caused by 4-Gang adherents".
But at that point in time, the situation had *changed*, in that
the Hua Guofeng group had started its (open) treason (from
November 1976 on, signs of this were visible) and so the
so-called "4-Gang adherents" protesting or fighting at *that*
time may well have been adherents of Mao Zedong's line,
*genuine* opponents of revisionism.

It will be interesting to hear what the Chinese you've been
talking to are saying on this and on the whole question.

At any rate, it would take some pretty heavy stuff, factwise,
to convince me that the main conclusions - very massively
documented and proven, I hold - of my Info #22en are false!

(Btw, one other posting of mine is of relevance too concering
the 4-Gang: "UNITE! Info #12en: China - NE (Germany), '75-'77",
in  6 parts, posted 08.07.96. This deals with another aspect
of the question, that of the Gang's connection with and
participation in the subversion against the international
M-l movement at the time. It doesn't give any information on
what the Chinese really thought of that group in China but
shows, among other things, why my then comrades, who lived
in exile here in Malmoe, Sweden, were deeply suspicious of it
even back in early 1975.)

The ball is yours, Jay!

Rolf M.






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