File spoon-archives/marxism-general.archive/marxism-general_1998/marxism-general.9805, message 128


Date: Sat, 9 May 1998 23:13:37 +0200 (MET DST)
From: rolf.martens-AT-mailbox.swipnet.se (Rolf Martens)
Subject: M-G: 1/2 To Blythe, request for more info on mailing list


1/2 To Blythe, request for more info on mailing list
[Sent: 09.05.98 - in 2 parts so I can Cc it to M-G list]

Hello NY Transfer News Collective (Blythe Systems),

I'm writing to you about the possibility of setting up a
Marxism mailing list hosted by you. 

On this, you've already had some correspondence with Siddharth 
Chatterjee <siddhart-AT-mailbox.syr.edu>, who's a subscriber to the
soon-to-be-closed Marxism-General mailing list (M-G) run by the 
Spoon Collective and who on 27.04 forwarded some information 
from you on this subject to the other subscribers to this list.

I'm a subscriber to the M-G too and, like Sid, very interested
in there being established, somewhere, a replacement for M-G,
which used to be a completely open, unmoderated, uncensored and
unrestricted mailing list, the thing that's really needed, some
of us hold, for a Marxism list. 

I have some requests for more information from you, and shall
give you some specifications concerning what kind of list some
of us are interested in, replying on this to some questions you 
asked in a mail on 26.04 signed by Kathleen Kelly. I'm Cc-ing 
this mail I'm writing now to the M-G list too, and intend to do 
the same with your reply. 

Together with this mail, I shall also forward to you two posts
which I sent to M-G on 05.05:

"The M-G charter (still current) etc", reproducing that charter,
and "M-G's openness charter vs certain proposals & actions!", a
comment by me on what kinds of list conditions, I believe, most
present M-G subscribers do *not* want - I certainly don't.

Hosting the present M-G subscriber crowd on a new mailing list
may cause some pressure to be brought on you from some powerful
quarters; experience shows we're (fortunately) "uncomfortable" 
to some people, as Sid probably has already told you. I note
your saying, in your reply to him, i.a.:

>We host many different political activist groups; we do not 
>belong to any of these groups. We maintain our total 
>independence in this way, and we follow NO party line at all. 
>We simply believe that the members of NY Transfer have views 
>that deserve to be heard. We make sure that they are heard, and 
>we have a rather excellent track record in confounding all 
>attempts to interfere with our members' news distribution. 

That sounds good. An "M-G replacement" list certainly will en-
counter interference attempts.

You asked Siddharth on 26.04, firstly:

>1. how much traffic is there on average per day? We have many 
>servers with different operating systems (Linus, solaris, NT, 
>etc.) This information is needed to plan the proper server and 
>operating system for your list....[and:]

>Each group in NY Transfer's political membership is unique. 
>We therefore price our mailing lists and websites individually. 
>It depends entirely on your requirements.

Traffic would be in the region of 10 posts a day, often probably
less than 5 but with occasional tops of some 20. 

Judging by how things were on M-G between Oct 1996 and Jan 1998,
when the administrators restricted posting to max 1 a day (and
max 10 K of length) for each subscriber, that's what we'd need,
initially at least. (After the intention to close the list was
announced, last April, the 1-a-day restriction was taken away
again, and traffic is 5-10 posts per day.) 

You wrote:

>Mailing lists: $70/year and up, depending on traffic levels,
>special security needs, etc.. $70 a year is our basic price 
>for a small mailing list.

10 posts per day perhaps is a "small" list? It wouldn't matter
much to us, I think, if the cost was somewhat bigger than $70.

It would be a good thing to have possibilities for, say, 40 
posts per day for somewhat later. A predecessor of M-G which 
existed up until Oct 1996 did have, in mid-1996, a volume of 
some 80 posts a day even, and was then said to be a "very high 
volume list", which the new list planned now *might* later 
become too. But for now, some 10 posts per day, with possibility
for some 20, would suffice.

We at present are some 90 subscribers to M-G, with some 30 more
subscribing (only) to a Digest.

My info request 1: 	Approximately how much would you charge
			per year for such a list (average 10
			posts per day, min 5-, max some 20?)

My info request 2:	Approximately how much per year for a 
			(possibly later resulting) 40-posts-per-
			day list? 

The present M-G list comes in a Digest form too, which people 
since 1996 have had the option of subcribing to instead (or
also); it has some 40 K in each issue and its issues (now) 
appear 2-3 times per week. With traffic at some 10 posts per
day, a Digest doesn't seem (to me) all that necessary to have. 
It might be of interest if traffic gets bigger. For now, I
won't request any info from you on a Digest possibility.

But one thing that would be of considerable interest is the
possibility of running an archive of all previous posts to
that Marxism list we're thinking of, an archive that would be
publicly available.

Such an archive would (more or less) quickly swell in volume of
course. Just a guess on my part about how quickly: If 10 posts
per day average 10 K in length each (most would be much briefer
but some rather long too), then an archive would contain some
3 MB per month. With each year, 36 MB would be added to the
archive (if traffic remains at that level). Now I on my part
have no idea of what website costs are likely to be in general.
You wrote on 26.04. i.a.:

>Websites: A 5-meg website is included free with every account. 
>Larger sites are available on request. Each is priced 
>individually.

My info request 3:	Approximately how much would you charge
			per year for an archive website that
			contains a) 36 MB? (my guess about the
			space needed for 1 year), b) 100 MB?
			c) 200 MB?

Those b) and c) above are in the case an archive could be kept
open that would contain the list postings of some years back,
at least. Perhaps that would cost more than we can afford; 
there are various options such as keeping archived just the
list postings over a period of 3 years back or 1 year back etc. 

The Spoons Collective, I gather, has been allowed to use the
(rather advanced) hardware of the university at Jefferson
Village, Virginia, USA. I suppose that's why they've been able
to maintain such good list archives. (Since last April, though,
those have become "verboten" too, to the public, at least those
of the various Spoon lists that pertain to Marxism in some way.)

[Continued in part 2/2] 



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