File spoon-archives/marxism-general.archive/marxism-general_1998/marxism-general.9805, message 294


Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 22:13:51 +0100
From: Chris Burford <cburford-AT-gn.apc.org>
Subject: Re: M-G: On the close down of Marxism space


At 07:41 PM 5/22/98 +0100, Mark wrote:
>How on earth, by what dreadful mischance, did you new subscribers
>stumble into this stinking morass?
>
>This list has no connection with marxism and arguably never has had.
>This list is for chernobyl-fans, moronites, chamberpots and sparts. 


I do not really see that Mark in this post is doing more than trying to get
people for whom he has contempt, expelled from an unmoderated lists. There
are several moderated lists now. Why try to close down the only unmoderated
one? 

Why ignore the quality of the newcomers contributions (and there have been
two or three newcomers per month), when they could be engaged? 

Doug's challenge to Hugh is one of the reasons for one unmoderated list.
Marxism space as a collective entity is shaped by such challenges. What if
all moderated lists were separate from each other?

While I am on record as criticising Bob's contributions which I think are
typically spart - no potential for dialogue in the criticism, just exposure
of everything wrong in everyone else's position; Hugh will argue a mean
argument. I have to think how to counter his reply on united fronts. And
while I have certainly challenged the stereotyped nature of Hugh's history
it just isn't accurate to say that he doesn't report issues of current
struggles. I gave the example of workers aid to Bosnia. That is a concrete
initiative in a very complex political situation. And it was well thought out.

And even with Spartacists it is not right to be totally undialectical. I
think I record Doug making a positive remark about the material produced by
the former spart (Norton?) before the split in recent years.

I know Hugh feels he has to polemicise with bravado, but that is not
confined to Trotsyists. I really do not understand what you, Louis P and
Doug mean if you are implying that Hugh's contributions are totally
worthless. To expect newcomers to accept on principle that his IQ is
significantly less than Louis's and he is some sub-mensch is implictly it
seems to me to tell newcomers that any one on this list is at risk of being
dehumanised. 

I am not questioning the right of moderators on a moderated list to bar
someone. I can see that Hugh just would not add to the mix that is shaping
up on LBO-talk at present. But we are talking about one unmoderated list
here, and I cannot accept that to dismiss it as a morass is appropriate to
the over 100 subscribers it has.

What purpose are you trying to serve?

Chris Burford

London.



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