Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 19:52:20 +0100 (MET)
From: malecki-AT-algonet.se (Robert Malecki)
Subject: M-I: Re: M-G: so-called "deformed workers states"


>dear Bob Malecki,
>
>I would hope that YOU and others would think over the brief
>critique of the Russian (state capitalist--Neil) regime
>by Simone Wiel from "Revolution proletarienne
># 158", Aug. 1933 that you posted 1/21/97.

Sorry Neil, but there is no way you can possibly convince me of your "state 
capitalist" theory. The main reason is because I am a Trotskyist and you 
know how Trotskyist's think on this question.
>
>Other than her false belief that mere state ownership
>of industry is intrinsically  historically progressive and pro worker,
>she is quite correct about the Russian  proletariat being completely 
>disenfrandchised  from their  gains of  the Oct 1917
>revolution.

Actually she made some very good points and I am publishing the piece in 
Cockroach. As far as the Russian Proletariat being wripped off, you also 
know that the Trotskyists have a fairly good picture of what and why it 
happened in regards to Stalinism. But we also no the difference between the 
former Soviet Union and Imperialism and that is why historically the 
Trotskyist's defended the Soviet Union.
>
>She is also correct about the 9-lives nature of that
>'stinking corpse of social democracy" which having
>become openly counterrevolutionary in 1914, became
>the trojan horse of the  German , Dutch and Italian
>soviets, esp. in the the 1918-20 period and helped the
>capitalists from within to derail and physically  smash the most
>promising prospects for mass proletarian revolution
>and give bourgeois  reaction a new lease on  its 
>wage slave promoting life.

Nothing really new about this stuff actually. I mean Lenin wrote the Social 
democracy off in 1914! But this does not mean that Trotskyists do not have 
tactics in regards to both Stalinist organisations and the Social democracy. 
By going out in the desert and screaming smash the unions and the rest of 
the ultra left bullshit you have been coming with Neil actually means that 
in a lot of instances you wind up actually having the same position as the 
bosses.
>
>I have repaetedly asked on this list that those a la
>Proyect & Sons who cover up for social democracy deal openly and honestly
>with the material class reasons for the splits in the 
>workers mass movements in the early 20s!
>Stoney silence prevailed!

Asking Proyect to present want of his long and boring anti-Bolshevik 
articles or a critisism of the Social democracy when he in practice supports 
the politics of Menshevism and Stalinism is just ridiculous. In the final 
analisis Proyect has a political program which is no better! Just the same 
old crap that has been going on for decades. And now the gang appears to be 
very busy with the if and buts of "market socialism" with some of them 
trying to create the image of a oh so leftie profile.
>
> Mere quotations from opportunists &  centrists trying to re-create
>the same old mistakes or even  bible thumping from 
>"Left wing communism" of Lenin totally out of
>historical context just won't do!

You will have to be more concrete about the above. It has been a while since 
I have read the piece but I certainly agree with Lenin if I remeber 
correctly and also Trotsky when it comes to both "State Capitalism" and you 
twitch of ultra left childness that appears time and again on a range of 
subjects.
>
>Bob! I say again what about the WESTERN SOVIETS?
> Let's deal with the heroic works of them, either
>workers, soldiers or sailors!(circa 1915-21)

OK! Do you want to talk about Soviets? Fine. Basically my position on the 
Soviets is that they are a form of organisation that appears in 
pre-revolutionary and revolutionary situations when the traditional 
organisations of the Proletariat  can not meet the tasks facing them. 
However the one certainly does not exclude the other..

Bob Malecki

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