Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 17:39:28 -0500
From: Louis Proyect <lnp3-AT-columbia.edu>
Subject: Re: M-I: Che and other things


Jim Hillier:
>Also, to engage them, you have to argue with them. The trouble is, when
>you do - all you get is a tirade. Look, I know Adolfo. He is
>intelligent. And yet he can make outrageous claims - Castro is a
>fascist, and Cuba is a fascist state - which have no basis in Marxism
>whatsoever. 

It's really quite simple. If Adolfo writes a post on social-fascism, I will
delete it as soon as I gather that's where its going. If he writes about
Peru, I will read it carefully. This is always the way I have dealt with
Adolfo.

>Take this stuff about social fascism. If Castro is a social fascist, I
>kind of guess that Gus Hall must be, too. And yet until he was thrown
>out, Lou was a member of what one must presume, according to his own
>criteria, is the social-fascist CPUSA. 

I have no idea what's up with Godena. There are really some strange bats
fluttering around in his belfry nowadays, with the Richard Pipes
enthusiasm, etc.. To go from CP membership to that kind of reading material
in less than a year is pretty mind-boggling. Although, who knows, it might
be catching. Over on Marxism-General, the arch-Trotskyist of a year
ago--Vladimir Bilenkin--is now defending the same position on WWII that
Mark Jones defended here. This is the Vladimir Bilenkin who used to
castigate me as a neo-Stalinist lickspittle.

>
>With Mark, it is even more exasperating. He takes the piss out of Gary
>MacLennan, but what is he actually doing to build a revolutionary party
>in Britain? Nothing at all. It is all very well to talk about people's
>war, but there needs to be some action. 

Look, Mark is too old to belong to a party. So is Gary and so am I. That's
for youngsters like you to get involved with. I paid my dues. The joke with
all of us--Adolfo and Lou Godena included--is that we lead very staid
middle-class existences off this list. The last time I made an attempt to
speak to Godena, I called his house and his wife told me that he was out
shopping but I could call him on his cell phone. All of a sudden I got the
picture of Lou pushing a grocery cart at the A&P with his kids in tow and
his phone rings. "Hello?" "Yeah, Louis, it's Louis Proyect." "What's up?"
"About this Richard Pipes stuff--this is a declaration of war." "Wait a
second (no, I told you that Fruit Loops are *not good* for you)...What's
that now?"

>In the history of the revolutionary movement since the sino-soviet
>split, there have been plenty of people who talk about violent
>revolution, but who do nothing. I, too, want violent revolution, and I
>am doing all I can, to the best of my ability, to try to unite with
>those who also think along these lines here in Britain. 

This mailing-list is not exactly a place to establish one's credentials.
This is where everybody is the greatest revolutionary of the century. How
do we know that? Because, they say so. I think the best use of the list is
to exchange ideas. Some of the most interesting discussion I have is
off-list with Mark Jones, but it usually has something to do with
discussions here or on PEN-L. "Debates" with people who think you are the
devil simply don't go anywhere. That's why I don't have them any more.

>We don't have flames. We don't have condescending sneering. We don't
>have vicious denunciations. We don't have James Heartfield and the like,
>either. It is a bit slow at times, it is a bit limited, but it is a
>worthwhile ongoing attemptto use this medium as a tool in the struggle
>against capitalism and imperialism. It would be better if we had you,
>Mark and a load of others, but that is not to be, evidently.

Well, let me know when you get the darn thing automated.

Louis Proyect



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