File spoon-archives/marxism-thaxis.archive/marxism-thaxis_1997/marxism-thaxis.9712, message 530


Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 22:19:35 -0500 (EST)
From: Justin Schwartz <jschwart-AT-freenet.columbus.oh.us>
Subject: Re: M-TH: Rape & Punishment



Am I the only person who thinks that it's mad to suppose that capitalism
is the cause of rape and that the abolition of capitalism will eliminate
rape? Rape is a good deal older than capitalism. It persist in
post-capitalist societies like the USSR. Doubtless it is promoted by the
sort of alienation that capitalism involves. But it's a rather silly and
naive view to imagine that rape or any other crime is simply a
manifestation of capitalism, narrowly, or class, more broadly. It has a
lot to with the causally independent dynamics of patriarchy, with regard
to rape in particular. And there is the factor of free will. 

No one really thinks that punishment is "the solution" to rape, in the
sense that if we punish it effectively and severely taht will deter all
rapes. Rapists,like other criminals, are often not wholly rational actors.
Doubtless punishment does deter some rapes. In any case punishment also
serves retributive purposes taht are independent of its consequences. But
if I had to guess, I would bet that a socialist society would need rape
laws for both deterrence and retributive purposes. 

--jks

  

On Mon, 15 Dec 1997, Rebecca Peoples wrote:

> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rebecca Peoples <wellsfargo-AT-tinet.ie>
> To: marxism-thaxis-AT-jefferson.village.Virginia.EDU
> <marxism-thaxis-AT-jefferson.village.Virginia.EDU>
> Date: 15 December 1997 04:05
> Subject: M-TH: Rape & Punishment
> 
> 
> Hi James,
> 
> I hope you had an enjoyable weekend.
> 
> I have been doing some work on the rape issue. Many people are of the
> opinion that the way in which rape against women is eliminated or scaled
> down is by putting the men that so attack women behind bars even to the
> extent of throwing away the key.
> 
> My view is that punishment is no solution. I see the existence of rape as
> having its source in capitalism itself. Consequently the only way in which
> to eliminate the problem of rape is by eliminating its source, capitalism.
> This being so a campaign against rape must be based in the context of
> replacing socialism with capitalism. This entails mounting the campaign as
> an attack on the state and capitalism itself. This means forcing the state
> to intervene positively towards eliminating the problem --struggling for
> reforms in a revolutionary context. In this way the participants in the
> campaign and the working class will tend to experience the positive
> intervention of the state as due to mass revolutionary pressure while at the
> same time increasingly demonstrating the limits of the state concerning
> achieving a solution to the problem. The logic of such a campaign entails
> challenging the state and its ultimate overthrowal.
> 
> Having said all this James my problem and it is, in a way, a concrete one is
> the issue of imprisonment. I have not yet found a way of relating to the
> issue of the imprisonment of rapists to the strategy outlined above. If
> feminism is calling longer and harsher imprisonment of rapists how  do
> revolutionary socialists respond. It is a difficult problem so I am not
> necessarily asking you for something definitive but for some comments that
> might prove of some help to me in this regard. Remember James it is the
> imprisonment issue which I am immediately concerned with. This is the
> problem I want you to particularly respond to. The drug abuse problem has a
> similar character in relation to the punishment issue.
> 
> 
> Fraternally,
> James
> should be Fraternally Rebecca --sorry
> 
> 
> 
>      --- from list marxism-thaxis-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu ---
> 
> 
> 
>      --- from list marxism-thaxis-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu ---





     --- from list marxism-thaxis-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu ---

   

Driftline Main Page

 

Display software: ArchTracker © Malgosia Askanas, 2000-2005