File spoon-archives/marxism-thaxis.archive/marxism-thaxis_1998/marxism-thaxis.9803, message 5


Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 00:23:18 +1100
From: Rob Schaap <rws-AT-comserver.canberra.edu.au>
Subject: Re: M-TH: Moderators' Note


Evening Thaxists,

I was gonna reply to Ralph privately, but it's a moderation issue so here
it is, if you're interested.  If you wanna say something about it, it might
be best to contact Bill and/or me privately (remember, Bill's fast asleep
right now, so this is just me for now), but it's up to you.

>As for who should have to endure what from whom .... Go fuck yourself, Rob.

In a minute, Ralph - a couple of points of my own first.

>I get a whiff of feminazi tactics here.

I suspect what you're sensing must be one of those absences Bhaskar goes on
about.  In fact, I openly tend to your side of many arguments (when you
deign to wrap your vitriol in them) with Yoshie.  I can not for instance
grasp what she and Carrol are getting at on the 'hard choices' thread and
what I do take them to be saying worries me.  I also don't like the style
Yoshie adopts in her disagreements with Leo (with whom I also tend to agree
in these things).  But here's the point, Yoshie gets angry but generally
throws argument with her venom.  You often do that too.  It's the way
things are done on these lists and it is not for me to try to change this
(I can't believe how hard a lot of you Yanks are on each other).

What is for a moderator is to ensure that all can enter debates, that the
debates are about things that matter to the sort of people who might look
us up, and that these people will not be intimidated, irritated or bored by
too much extraneous nonsense.  Of the latter we need some - I do agree with
Carrol about one thing; much of our communication is phatic.  But posts
that exist only to insult someone's person - well, to me it's an easy line
to draw.

Two notes for your interest:
>
>(1) "ignorant slut" is an old joke from "Saturday Nite Live" about two
>decades ago: Jane Curtin and Dan Ackroyd used to do a point-counterpoint
>debate in the old "60 Minutes" format.  After Jane would deliver her
>argument, Dan would preface his rebuttal by saying: "Jane, you ignorant
>slut."  It's a joke, son.

A joke depends on its context, dad.  You didn't provide it.

>Had I really wished to let Yoshie have it for
>real, in my own words, I would have written: "Yoshie, you half-baked English
>Dept. cunt!"

And now you have.

>(2) Had I intended to seriously insult Yoshie the Two-Bit Academicunt, it
>would be no worse than the crap she's been spewing at me, Justin, and others.

And now you have again.

>Rob, you're a hypocrite fueled by feminazi double standards.

Nope.  I'm afraid I'm fueled by a confusion and I'm looking here for
something of higher octane to drive me.  Shit like you threw all over
Yoshie just gets in the way.  I happen to know one can fundamentally
disagree with Yoshie on big items and maintain enough mutual good will to
avoid ad hominems, keep channels open, and avoid imposing vitriolic waste
bandwidth on others.

>Perhaps
>because you're a two-bit hackademic yourself and a pusillanimous piss-ant.

I'm not going to waste time defending myself or swopping insults, Ralph.  I
happen to think 'fuck' and 'cunt' damned gutsy words - the latter all but
excised from our patter by a bunch whose politics is even more confused
than mine.  But I do know vicious and gratuitous attacks when I see 'em.
And Bill and I have been quite clear on that.  If you want to set yourself
up for some sort of self-styled martyrdom, I'm prepared to go along.  A bit
of a pity as I wanted to read you on Bhaskar, but there it is.  One more
absolutely gratuitous spit like that one and you go to the sin bin as far
as I'm concerned - and for a good while.  And don't waste that spit on me -
find someone who gives a toss.

>Fuck you.

You're better than this, Ralph.  I hope I'm wrong, but I suspect you're
gonna feel the need to push this one as far as it will go.  I don't know
why.

And I really hope you don't.

Cheers,
Rob.



************************************************************************

Rob Schaap, Lecturer in Communication, University of Canberra, Australia.

Phone:  02-6201 2194  (BH)
Fax:    02-6201 5119

************************************************************************

'It is questionable if all the mechanical inventions yet made have
lightened the day's toil of any human being.'    (John Stuart Mill)

"The separation of public works from the state, and their migration
into the domain of the works undertaken by capital itself, indicates
the degree to which the real community has constituted itself in
the form of capital."                                    (Karl Marx)

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