File spoon-archives/marxism-thaxis.archive/marxism-thaxis_1998/marxism-thaxis.9803, message 542


Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 14:24:11 -0500 (est)
From: Gerald Levy <glevy-AT-pratt.edu>
Subject: M-TH: Re: wiggle them hips


Yoshie wrote:
 
> Jerry wrote:
> >Yeshie:

Sorry about the misspelling. 

> >1) Stay or go. That's your decision. Just spare us the whining about it.
> I return the above statement to the sender.

Fair enough.
 
> Is it sexist to take note of the gender disparity on a marxist list that is
> *far worse* (I repeat) than Yale of 20 years ago, not to mention today's
> *multinational corporations*?

Did I say that it was?

> Should marxist organizations be *more*
> male-dominated than capitalist profit-making institutions?

Uuuugh ... let me think. No, Marxist organizations shouldn't be _more_
male-dominated ....
 
> Why are Marxist groups "willy-nilly dominated by men"? Why is the degree of
> male domination higher here than in many other capitalist institutions? Any
> thought on the matter? (See, also, my comment on your second set of
> statements.)

These are good questions. I have some thoughts on the matter .... which I
can't express now since I have to go to work.
 
> >6) I find your lamentations about the lack of discussion of "queer theory"
> >   to be rather odd especially since you were (unless my memory is failing
> >   me) silent when Mark Jones talked on m-int about how the _New Left
> >   Review_ was a "faggot-valhalla" controlled by M16. With such openly
> >   displayed and vicious homophobia, it is no wonder that lesbian and gay
> >   activists would not find the Spoons marxism lists to be particularly
> >   welcoming or encouraging.
> This is a damned lie.

So you did condemn Mark for his homophobia? Then I apologize.
 
> >7) If you want more women, etc. on this list, why don't you just set the
> >   example and do some recruiting?
> So it is only women's job to recruit women, but marxist men can sit around
> and do nothing about it?

Uuugh ... did I say that? 
 
> Is this problem not a worthy subject of discussion on the list? Should we
> not think of how to correct it, instead of, as Jerry does, saying that
> "Marxist groups in general, and internationally, are willy-nilly dominated
> by men"? 

Did I say that we should not think about correcting it?

> Don't posts like Jerry's (re: "Wiggle them hips") constitute a big
> turn-off for women who might possibly become interested in taking part in a
> list like this and marxism?

So you are speaking for all women? btw, I was just using the subject line
chosen by another, which you also used.

> When a woman raises an issue or utters a criticism, men like Jerry
> trivializes it as whining.

You can not legitimately infer that if I say that you were whining, then I
say that others are whining. Moreover, it is illegitimate to infer that
that comment was made because "a women ... raises an issue or utters a
criticism."  Furthermore, you accused me of whining above. So cut the crap
and the misrepresentations.

Before you make such bold assertions, you had better check the record.

Jerry



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