Date: Sun, 13 Nov 1994 13:44:24 -0500 From: quilty-AT-philos.umass.edu (Lulu of the Lotus-Eaters) Subject: Re: Exploitation and all that... The prolific Justin Schwartz again: *} Let's set the tone stuff aside. If I have been arrogant and condescending *} I apologize. Sounds good. I'd rather talk about Marxist theory than quibble over he-said she-said stuff. *} You and Peter in the following post both note that in my account of *} exploitation as forced surplus transfer, we do not have a general, *} society-wide measure of the rate of exploitation (quantity of surplus *} transfer) absent a notion of socially necessary labor time, which can only *} apply in a generalized commodity economy. As I think about it, I think the example I used really is central to why my intuition goes against the meaningfulness of using exploitation as a quantitative comparison of direct labor-hours. To me it just seems a bit absurd to think that I might be exploited if I "buy American", but not exploited if I buy Guatamalan. That is, buying low-wage-produced goods thereby has me consume more (incorporated) labor-hours. As far as I can see, this Schwartzian notion of exploitation just cannot avoid the conclusion that exploitation is largely determined by consumer choices (especially between material (near-)identical items). As the analytic philosophers would say, one choice Schwartz has is just to "bite the bullet" (dunno why they always seem to like that metaphor). That is Schwartz could say, "Although the conclusion above seems counterintuitive, it is a consequence worth living with for a theory of exploitation which is better in these other respects (allows one to understand more exploitative situations, etc)!" On the other hand, Schwartz could point out reasons to convince my intuitions that consumer choices really do determine exploitation. Or thirdly, he could point out why I have misunderstood the consequences of direct labor-time calculation of exploitation. I suppose the fourth possibility is just to ignore the question :-). *} If my reading is "heterodox," I don't see that as a criticism, but I also *} doubt whether it is heterodox. Mandel and I both got the idea that labor *} time is (a) measure of exploitation in all social circumstances from Marx, *} whom I quoted on this a few posts back. I don't see "orthodoxy" as a *} virtue, although scholarship is valuable to know what Marx said. I didn't mean 'heterodox' as a criticism. More heterodox ideas are correct than are orthodox ones IMO (which is btw. equivalent to: "most common beliefs are wrong" ;)). My point was just that Schwartz cannot assume readers to share his reading of 'productive' off the bat. Perhaps we could be convinced of it, but a certain note need be made that the Schwartzian 'productive' goes along with the Schwartzian 'exploitation' (though such a note *was* basically made). Yours, Lulu... quilty-AT- _/_/_/_/_/_/_/ THIS MESSAGE WAS BROUGHT TO YOU BY:_/_/_/_/_/ v i philos. _/_/ Postmodern Enterprises _/_/ s r umass. _/_/ MAKERS OF CHAOS.... _/_/ i u edu _/_/_/_/_/ LOOK FOR IT IN A NEIGHBORHOOD NEAR YOU_/_/_/_/_/_/ g s ------------------
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