From: "Karl Carlile" <joseph-AT-indigo.ie> Date: Wed, 3 Jul 1996 11:00:31 +0000 Subject: Waklter Daum and Karl Carlile Karl: I was unable to earlier respond to your interesting piece. Daum: Bourgeois nationalists in the oppressed countries looked to the Soviet Union for support against imperialism and as a model for their own countries. To fend off the imperialists, the nation needs to mobilize and retain the bulk of its own internally produced surplus value, so that the fruits of exploitation can be put to use at home rather than abroad. It also has to repress internal capitalists who have interests tied more directly to imperialism. And it has to keep down independent activity by workers and peasants, whose aspirations for a better life are whetted by the anti-imperialist struggle. These conditions require a centralized state apparatus, and the Stalinist Soviet model (not the 1917 example of workers' revolution!) provided it. In countries where the old bourgeoisie was too weak, the CPs took over and carried out nationalizations bureaucratically. Karl: You exclusively identify surplus labour with surplus value. Furthermore you exclude from consideration the possibility of a scenario in which the struggle for national self-determination led by the proletraitat and supported by sections of the petty bourgeoise is achieved in the form of a revolutionary workers' state in which the law of value is domestically destroyed so that surplus labour no longer assumes the reactioanry form of surplus value. There is no identification by you of the class basis for stalinist parties undertaking "nationalizations bureaucratically". Daum: But they first sought to lead coalitions with shadow bourgeois parties, to legitimize their own role in defense of the national capital. Karl: The above comment begs the question. It assumes that stalinism is defending the national capital. There is no account offered by you to justify this assumption. You never explain how nationalisation by stalinism is, ipso facto, the protection of national capital and is indeed a specific form of capital. Daum: At a second stage, when imperialism wouldn't accept the CPs' leading role, they moved to eliminate most private property, after having incorporated some bourgeois elements into the state apparatus. Karl: The elimination of the private property form and the retention of the form of capitalist property is impossible. Capitalist property is a specific form of private property. Daum: But the exploitation relation between capital and labor is not changed simply by statification from above. Karl: You make a very big assumption here yet fail to support it with any argument. It is the axis around which the recent List debate on state capitalism centred. Since labour power under capitalism is a commodity and thereby a form of private property are you suggesting that labour power has been statified and is no longer a form of private property? Daum: In most of the former colonial countries, separation from imperialism was won by non-Stalinist petty-bourgeois forces who neither could decapitate their proletariats as effectively as the Stalinists nor wished to centralize property to the same extent. Whether Stalinist or not, the new nationalist rulers saw their goal as defending and expanding the nation-state and the national capital. Some chose to welcome imperialist investment; others preferred to build up local industries with state aid to produce needed goods at home rather than import them. Almost all used some form of socialist or populist rhetoric to justify strengthening the state and capital. In this light, the theory of permanent revolution has to be extended. A central point of Trotsky's theory was that the bourgeoisie feared to challenge *any* form of property, given the potential threat of the proletariat. Therefore throughout this century it has been unable to carry out the democratic and national tasks of the bourgeois revolution: Trotsky assigned that task to the proletariat. But under specific conditions -- where the proletariat has been defeated or decapitated and its threat to property thereby temporarily removed, and where the traditional bourgeoisie is too feeble to pose even a temporary break from imperialism -- elements from the bureaucratic middle classes have seized the reins of power. Such nationalists could even resort to the dangerous step of statifying property, if the workers had been effectively excluded from independent activity. Karl: The statification of the means of production and distribution does not necessarily mean that the democratic and national tasks of the bourgeois revolution have been carried out. Indeed the absence of democracy is among the more blatant reactionary features of the kind of regimes to which you make reference. This means that your suggestion that Trotsky's conception of permanent revolution requires modification does not hold up here. You interchange stalinist and nationalist here without offering any explanation for the identity. Again you don't support with any argument your claim that the bureaucratic middle classes have an interest in carrying out the democratic and national tasks especially where there is an absence of any threat from the working class. Neither do you explain why you suggest there obtains an identity between stalinism and the bureaucratic middle classes. Daum: The theory of permanent revolution illuminates the initial success and the later collapse of third-world nationalism. In 1930 Trotsky wrote a perceptive critique of Stalin's policy of "national socialism," which applies with equal force to the postwar third-world countries: "Marxism proceeds from world economy, not as a sum of national parts but as a mighty, independent reality, which is created by the international division of labor and the world market, and, in the present epoch, predominates over the national markets. The productive forces of capitalist society have long ago grown beyond the national frontier. The imperialist war was an expression of this fact. In the productive-technical respect, socialist society must represent a higher stage compared to capitalism. "To aim at the construction of a *nationally isolated* socialist society means, in spite of all temporary successes, to pull the productive forces backward even as compared to capitalism. To attempt, regardless of the geographic, cultural and historical conditions of the country's development, which constitutes a part of the world whole, to realize a fenced-in proportionality of all the branches of economy within national limits, means to pursue a reactionary utopia." Indeed, national economic independence for the ex-colonial countries could only be temporary during the period of relative prosperity after the war. This was the time when the bureaucratic middle strata grew rapidly in all countries. The illusions of viable third systems and in third-world nationalism reflected the self-inflation of these layers. The new nationalist rulers eventually had to break from the fantasy that they could flourish independent of international capitalism. Karl: The case is quite the contrary Daum. A period of imperialist prosperity is an expression of the growing strength of imperialism. It follows then that the imperialist bourgeoisie is better placed to prevent the emergence of independent nation states. If independent capitalist states existed, as you claim, then they cannot be, as you suggest, fantasy. Just because a social phenomenon eventually comes to an end does not mean it was a "fantasy". It is possible that under exceptional conditions an indigenous bourgeoisie can establish a "independent" native capitalist state in the epoch of late imperialism. Obviously there are no completely independent capitalist powers. Even American capitalism is not completely independent. It is still an integrated part of the world capitalist system. It is misleading to suggest, as you do, that the emergence of an independent native capitalist state represents a step backwards for the development of world capital. Capital is a contradiction. Consequently the development of capital holds back the development of capital. To talk about the reactionary and non-reactionary development of capital is to misrepresent the nature of contemporary capitalism and thereby sow "fantasy" in it. Yours etc., --- from list marxism-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu ---
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