Date: Tue, 23 Apr 96 09:07:35 GMT
Subject: Re: Splits in the ruling class -Reply -Reply



Lisa writes:
> 
> Adam wrote:
> "There are real differences of interests between capitalists."
> 
> Lisa: Ok, we partially agree.
> 
> "In contrast, there are NO actual differences of interest between
> workers [snip] Any such differences are just "false consciousness"."
> 
> Lisa: and we partially disagree.
> 
> "There is a difference in the basic structure of our class on the one
> hand and their class on the other."
> 
> Lisa: I'm not sure what you mean by this, would you like to explain
> what you mean by structure of a class?
> 

What I meant by it is in the bits you quoted above :
> "There are real differences of interests between capitalists."
> "In contrast, there are NO actual differences of interest between workers.

So Marx wrote things like "workers have no country" and "workers, unite,
you have nothing to lose but your chains" , but he did not say the same
sort of things about capitalists. Capitalists really do rely on a nation
state, capitalists really do have competing interests.

There is also a difference between the modern proletariat and all other
previous revolutionary classes. All other revolutionary classes built
up their power and wealth within the pores of the old society, before
they were forced into revolution. The proletariat, in contrast, is
defined by its complete separation from the means of production
( compare with the peasantry, who own their land ) under capitalism.

This has effects on the ideas prevalent in the proletariat. The
capitalists had their religions, universities, philosophers, etc
before they embarked on revolution. We don't, we can't have such
institutions. So this is one reason why ruling class ideas can
easily gain a hold in the working class.

These ideas can only really be overcome by us coming together in
during the struggle. Marxism itself is only a distilation of the
high points of the struggle over different times and places.

> 
> BTW, there's got to be a better way to support this argument, on
> either side, than simple assertion of "false consciousness", but I
> don't think I have enough energy for this topic to try to go into
> that further.
> 

Part of the problem is that I have presented ideas in very abbreviated
form. The false consciousness has material roots in the competition
between workers. But I think it is still false consciousness, even if
it has material roots.

Adam.


Adam Rose
SWP
Manchester
UK


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