Date: Fri, 19 Apr 1996 20:25:21 +0200 From: Luciano Dondero <DOND001-AT-IT.net> Subject: This computer kills fascists: 12 (fwd) >Date: Fri, 19 Apr 1996 10:32:15 -0400 >To: marxchat-AT-stud.unit.no >From: tallpaul-AT-pipeline.com (tallpaul) > > CYBERNAZIS TARGET MARXIST NEWSGROUP > >Per I. Mathisen, the proposer for the USENET group >"soc.politics.marxism" asked me to write on the new attack on the >group by the cybernazis. A post intercepted from Milton Kleim >(the proposer of "rec.music.white-power" and leader of the Aryan >Internet Corps) to the nazi STORMFRONT mailing list shows the new >cybernazi attack and directly links it to Marxist opposition to >Kleim's attempt to get a group devoted to the whip-up-the-lynch- >mobs skinhead music established on the internet. A copy of >Kleim's post to STORMFRONT is included below, just above the >formal CALL FOR VOTES (CFV) of the Marxism group. > >Let me explain a bit of the history of the dispute on the >internet, and why your vote in favor of "soc.politics.marxism" is >necessary to defeat the new cybernazi effort. > >At present, the cybernazis have some six groups in the USENET >"alt" hierarchy. But other intercepted cybernazi documents showed >they wanted to get established in the more respected and more >widely carried "rec" hierarchy. To do this, they proposed that >the "rec.music.white-power" group be established. > >Anarchist, socialist, and anti-hate net citizens opposed the >cybernazi skinhead group and called for people to VOTE NO. Per >and his friends played a major role in this campaign. > >The cybernazis immediately claimed to represent nothing more than >an absolute belief in "freedom of speech" and maintained that >USENET rules stated that people should not oppose any news group >on political grounds. Numbers of overwhelming white, male, >economically privileged, conservative libertarians joined this >so-called free speech effort. They proclaimed they had "nothing >to do" with the nazis but urged people to vote for the nazi group >in order to "oppose censorship." > >Nobody was censored, nor were the nazis prevented from posting a >single article. (In my personal view this was an unfortunate >truth, but that is the way that the internet functions.) All of >the nazi messages could easily have been posted to the other six >nazi-oriented groups in the "alt" hierarchy. Even internet-savy >members of groups as politically divergent as the various >Trotskyist organizations to the Anti-Defamation League did not >call for the nazis to be kicked out of cyberspace or formally >deprived of their right to post messages in the "alt" news >groups. > >The campaign for people to VOTE NO on rec.music.white-power swept >the globe with people in numerous countries joining the >discussion in an effort even Milton Kleim called "UNPRECEDENTED >in internet history." This was probably the most accurate >sentence Kleim ever posted to the net. > >But now of course there is a different group to be voted on: >soc.politics.marxism. > >Now, "suddenly" Kleim and the cybernazis have put the issue of >absolute freedom of speech behind them, rediscovered Jew- >Bolshevism, and forgotten the "A.C.L.U." Of course, for those >familiar with nazis history this is neither new nor surprising. >But the STORMFRONT list to which Kleim posted his message has >upwards of 400 names on it. If the subscribers to the list all >support Kleim, then this is a 400-vote bloc that will oppose Per >and soc.politics.marxism to punish the group's antifascist >efforts. In order for a USENET group to get established, it must >win 2/3 of the votes cast where all internet users get a vote. >This also means that soc.politics.marxism needs another 800 votes >just to comfortably offset the possible STORMFRONT bloc vote. > >And workers revolution will likely return to Russia before the >libertarians who supported white-power music also vote "YES" on a >Marxism group. > >The official CFV on "soc.politics.marxism" is included below. It >tells you how to vote on the group and what exactly the group is >about. > > What You Can Do > >First you can vote in favor of soc.politics.marxism. > >Many of you will of course do this anyway. Others will now want >to support soc.politics.marxism as a *real* free speech issue, >especially since it is targeted by the cybernazis in revenge for >the principled antifascism by Per. > >But YES votes from the few people who read this series are not >sufficient to raise an additional 800 votes. To do this we all >need to get out the word of what is happening. This can be done >if you will inform friends of what is happening. Please feel free >to post this notice to discussion lists you are on *if >appropriate* to the list. Also, feel free to modify this in any >way you wish if you think you can do a better job than I of >explaining the issues. (Just kill my name as the author if you do >so.) > >*Do not* however modify the CFV in any way. Such things are >considered "vote fraud" by the USENET vote takers and may >invalidate the vote. > >[BEGIN KLEIM INTERCEPT TO STORMFRONT] > >|From: bb748-AT-freenet.carleton.ca (Milton Kleim) >|To: stormfront-l-AT-stormfront.org >|Date: Thu, 11 Apr 1996 17:02:16 -0400 >|Subject: SF: soc.politics.marxism >| >|Dear Comrades: >| >|The Bolsheviks have posted a Call for Votes for their proposed >|news group, soc.culture.marxism. >| >|As some of you are aware, the "soc" hierarchy is not intended >|for purely political discussions. It is for social issues. >| >|The Bolsheviks were in the forefront of opposing our news group, >|rec.music.white-power, not only on the ground of "racism," but >|also on the pretext that it didn't belong in the "rec" hierarchy >|because it allegedly would |deal with politics instead of music. >| >|Well, it's time to pay the Commies back. >| >|I urge you to vote NO on soc.politics.marxism. Please fill out >|this ballot, and send it to the vote taker. Thanks! >| >|-- Milton >| >|-- > >[END KLEIM INTERCEPT] > >[BEGIN CALL FOR VOTE, SOC.POLITICS.MARXISM] > > > FIRST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2) > moderated group soc.politics.marxism > >Newsgroups line: >soc.politics.marxism Karl Marx and his legacy in theory and >practice. (Moderated) > >Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 29 Apr 1996. > >This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party. Questions >about the proposal should be directed to the proponent. > >Proponent: Per I Mathisen <perim-AT-interlink.no> >Votetaker: Brennan Price <gt0670e-AT-prism.gatech.edu> > > >OFFICIAL SOURCES OF THE CFV > >The only official sources for copies of this CFV are the UseNet >newsgroups to which it is posted including >news.announce.newgroups and the votetaker. An official copy will >also be sent to the Marxism mail list after it is posted in >news.announce.newgroups. Contact >majordomo-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu if you want information >about the list. > > >RATIONALE: soc.politics.marxism > >There is currently no newsgroup dedicated to the discussion of >Marxist philosophy and politics. Such debate has long taken place >in the "Marxism" mailing list and occasionally on the newsgroup >alt.politics.socialism.trotsky. The "Marxism" list has currently >well over 300 subscribers and carries about 30-50 posts a day. >The above-mentioned newsgroup carries about 10-20 posts a day and >is no place for serious discussion since it is haunted by >irrelevant crossposts, off-topic conversations and extensive >flaming. Neither are moderated. > >The reason the "Marxism" mailing list is insufficient is because >many feel 30-40, often quite long, mails dropping into one's >mailbox is too much, and would prefer the quicker alternative of >browsing a newsgroup. A newsgroup is also more accessible for >newcomers. > >The soc.politics.* hierarchy was chosen because it fits well with >our intention of a newsgroup for discussion about marxism as >political, sociological and historical theory and as a means of >changing the world. > > >CHARTER: soc.politics.marxism > >This group is intended as a moderated forum for the discussion of >marxism and political topics in connection to marxism. This >includes, but is not restricted to, the political and >philosophical theories of Marx, the relevance and appliance of >Marx's theories in the modern world and the theories and >activities of Marxist political movements and parties both today >and in the past. > >Moderation Policy: > >The moderators reserve the right to reject any articles submitted >to soc.politics.marxism that are insulting, using more than 1/4 >quotation, off-topic or not at all related to marxism. Crossposts >will not be tolerated unless it is an announcement of relevance >or importance to the newsgroup. > >END CHARTER. > > >MODERATOR INFO: soc.politics.marxism > >Moderator: Per I Mathisen <perim-AT-interlink.no> >Contact address: marxism-request-AT-stud.unit.no >Submission address: marxism-AT-stud.unit.no > >The RFD stated that Chris Faatz <cfaatz-AT-teleport.com> would be >the moderator for this newsgroup. He decided that this work would >be too time-consuming for him, and therefore had to pass the >responsibility to somebody else. For the time being, this >responsibility has been taken by proponent of the newsgroup. > >END MODERATOR INFO. > > >HOW TO VOTE > >Erase everything above the "BEGINNING OF BALLOT" line and erase >everything below the "END OF BALLOT" line. Do not erase anything >between these lines and do not change the group names. >Basically, remove everything except the ballot - we have to save >them all on disk. > >Give your name on the line that asks for it. For each group, >place a YES or NO in the brackets next to it to vote for or >against it. If you don't want to vote on a particular group, >just leave the space blank. Don't worry about spacing of the >columns or any quote characters (">") that your reply inserts. > >Then mail the ballot to: gt0670e-AT-prism.gatech.edu >Just replying to this message should work. > >Quick voting checklist: >1) Fill in the ballot form shown below. >2) Delete the rest of the CFV from your reply. >3) Make sure your reply goes to gt0670e-AT-prism.gatech.edu. > >========== BEGINNING OF BALLOT: Delete everything before this line >========== >The only official sources of this ballot are Calls | FIRST CALL FOR >VOTES >For Votes cross-posted to news.announce.newgroups | >SOC-POLITICS-MARXISM >or e-mailed from the votetaker. Official ballots | OFFICIAL USENET >BALLOT >are distributed blank. Failure to use an official | ><fhjaoiser-0001> >ballot significantly increases the chances that >+------------------------- >the vote-counting software will be unable to process your vote. Beware. >----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >Give your real name here: >If you do not give your real name, your vote will be rejected. > >[Your Vote] Group (Don't vote on this line--vote below!) >----------------------------------------------------------------------------- >[ yes ] this.is.an.example.yes.vote >[ no ] this.is.an.example.no.vote >[abstain ] this.is.an.example.abstention >[ cancel ] this.is.an.example.cancellation > >[ ] soc.politics.marxism >============= END OF BALLOT: Delete everything after this line >============== > > >IMPORTANT VOTING PROCEDURE NOTES > >Anything other than the official ballot may be rejected by the automatic >vote >counting program. The votetaker will respond to your received ballots with > >an automated acknowledgement by e-mail - if you do not receive one within >several days, try again. It's your responsibility to make sure your vote >is >registered correctly. > >Only one vote per person, no more than one vote per account. Addresses and > >votes of all voters will be published in the final voting results list. > >Duplicate votes will be resolved in favor of the most recent valid vote. > >Anonymous votes will not be accepted. Votes mailed by WWW/HTML/CGI forms >are >considered anonymous votes. (The vote must be mailed directly from the >voter to the votetaker.) > >In cases where voting fraud is determined to have occurred, it is standard >operating procedure to delete ALL votes submitted by the violator. > >Anyone who distributes pre-filled ballots or modified copies of this CFV >commits voting fraud. While distributing an unmodified CFV is allowed, it >is strongly discouraged, as the process of redistribution often adds >headers >to the document that confuse the vote-taking software. Reference to the >official CFV in news.announce.newgroups or to a copy mailed directly from >the votetaker is preferred. > >When in doubt, ask the votetaker. > >--Brennan T. Price, UVV > Running UseVote 3.0 > >[END CALL FOR VOTE] > --Luciano Dondero-- --- from list marxism2-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu ---
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