Date: Sun, 2 Nov 1997 09:22:14 -0500
From: Ostrow/Kaneda <ostrow-AT-is2.nyu.edu>
Subject: Re: Who wields the fasces?



 deX wrote
>
>sorry i couldn't resist - this valiant thread is driving me nuts, saul. back
>to lurking, i promise.

Sorry deX to have brought you out and by such shabby means --  yet on the
other hand I have been wondering about your absence,  I thought a thread on
the subtle differences between ego gratification ( fascism) and a
self-consciousness capable of ethical and self reflexive thought both on
the individual and collective level would be right up your alley --  --

As for Tom you seem  to reside in a   gray area of good intention, on one
hand you have your work which is meant to contribute to the self-knowledge
of our society and on the other you are  incapable of critical
self-reflection --

Tom  step back, what conclusions can you draw concerning our present from
the meaning and reception of Hitler's speeches -- does this give you
insight into the psycho-social dynamic of the tedium of  life at the mall
-- which has produced a revollt against authority in the name of a
subjectivity premised on the irreality of the phantasmagoria of TV,
recorded music,  film a and video games ( remember the dis-enfranchised
youth of post-worlld war one they were fertile ground.) Well tom how are we
to account for the affect of this unreal,  that once could only have been
imagined which is now  being made real.

 Seemingly  the intersection of   these two realities, the imagined and
symbollic, have to some degree contributed to the radical concept of
authority mouthed by every troubled youth who makes it onto talk TV " you
can't judge me because you don't know me>" This phrase is the constitution
and the pledge of allegience of  to a radical conception of  sectarian
democaracy whose laws and values  are not applicable outside to anyone who
does not adhere to them , it can be a grouping as small as  --  a cliche
from school or a street gang to something as large and disjointed as a
national gang, "cult"  or a corporation.  Each has its own value system
which recognizes those exterrior to it as oppressive.  What each holds in
common though is that you can not and will not be able to judge them unless
you too particiapate in their system.   For who are you to judge -- on what
authority can you assert that what works for them is un acceptable and
unacceptable to whom?

 See Tom -- This thread has to do with the analysis that preceeds the
theory how are we to theorize fascism at this moment.  If we limit
ourselves to the historical model we are ignoring our own modernity. tp
focus on the historical model  leaves us   trying to explain our past
rather than our present.   In a world where the radical right  has
appropriate boththe look, cultural values and  rhetoric  of the radical
left of the 60's  to carry a message of self-determination   the pressing
questions for me are what general  ideological qualities can be abstracted
from fascism''s historical model that might constitute its underlying
value system  --  and perhaps the more pressing is the  sociological
question: does liberalism always lead to fascism--

Beyond thes questions what is most puzzling is why doesn't deX have
anything to contribute  is Fascism once stripped of its 19th century
racism and nationalism  the foundation for a global corporate feudalism or
radical democracy?  .... Then again it might just be a word that has been
emptied of its meaning used like fuck or shit ?
Well Tom...
why does that phrase make me  feel like HAL..."Well Dave..."

You will all now have to excuse me --  I have a busy week ahead ....

SAUL